<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>Sure that Prof wan't talking about CATCH-22? A book which influenced GR so could also apply </div><div id="AppleMailSignature">To GR, of course, but it seems less contained in that simplification. <br><br>Sent from my iPad</div><div><br>On Jan 3, 2017, at 6:45 PM, Chase Carnot <<a href="mailto:chase.carnot@gmail.com">chase.carnot@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="auto"><div dir="auto"><span style="font-family:sans-serif">Gottfried plays Hansel to Katje's Gretel. Amiright?</span><br></div><div dir="auto"><span style="font-family:sans-serif"><br></span></div>Interestingly, the reason I first picked up Gravity's Rainbow has something to do with misremembering. About nine years ago, a college professor gave my class a one-sentence synopsis of the book: a man discovers that World War II is a conspiracy to kill him. I would have to say the professor misremembered the book but it does capture the scope of the story and the paranoia. I purchased the book very shortly thereafter. The real story of an American GI whose erection is apparently quantum entangled with German rockets was even more fascinating. And, hey, maybe I don't have the book quite right. I haven't read it since the first go-round. I'm listening to the audiobook now in preparation for a more involved rereading.<div dir="auto"><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">(Also, I just joined the listserv. Let me know if I replied wrong or my etiquette is wanting.)</div></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Jan 3, 2017 6:09 PM, "John Bailey" <<a href="mailto:sundayjb@gmail.com">sundayjb@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">There's a fun parascience phenomenon called The Mandela Effect in<br>
which sizeable groups of people remember some historical fact firmly<br>
and conclusively one way even though they're wrong - ie a lot of<br>
people distinctly recall the Nelson Mandela died during the 80s, even<br>
though that's manifestly untrue. A lot remember the kids book The<br>
Berenstein Bears being spelled The Berenstain Bears. Heaps of other<br>
examples. (My favourite is the comedian Sinbad playing a genie in the<br>
movie Shazam, which never happened although I kind of remember it).<br>
Anyway, as pointless as the concept is, I'm sure there are plenty of<br>
examples of people misremembering Pynchon, perhaps more than almost<br>
any other writer. I have crystal images of scenes from his works that<br>
upon re-reading never existed. Just recently we talked here about the<br>
M&D scene in which Mason heatedly confronts the slave-driver, which<br>
doesn't actually happen in the book, yeah?<br>
<br>
On Wed, Jan 4, 2017 at 9:49 AM, Keith Davis <<a href="mailto:kbob42@gmail.com">kbob42@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> What is the usual Western rationality?<br>
><br>
> On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 4:41 PM, David Morris <<a href="mailto:fqmorris@gmail.com">fqmorris@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> Up to you, of course. But when you say things like "The novel is too<br>
>> deconstructive for the usual Western rationality," you should expect some<br>
>> blow-back, mostly because it is flat wrong.<br>
>><br>
>> David Morris<br>
>><br>
>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 3:30 PM, Bruno Nogueira <<a href="mailto:bruno.laze@gmail.com">bruno.laze@gmail.com</a>><br>
>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> Didn't know amateur discussion was prohibited here. I'll go back to my<br>
>>> lurker status.<br>
>>> About being silly, sometimes I forget that most people avoid being<br>
>>> earnest if it's not masked in irony, sarcasm, etc.<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> 2017-01-03 15:13 GMT-06:00 Keith Davis <<a href="mailto:kbob42@gmail.com">kbob42@gmail.com</a>>:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I considered that, but thought my answer could use some explication...or<br>
>>>> maybe I just don't when to shut up!<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 4:10 PM, David Morris <<a href="mailto:fqmorris@gmail.com">fqmorris@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> Just in case you misunderstood, I was asking Bruno, not you, Keith.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Keith Davis <<a href="mailto:kbob42@gmail.com">kbob42@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>> Thank you!<br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>> Ok, here's another answer. Most, possibly all, of the people who come<br>
>>>>>> here, and have been here for a while, are here because we're big fans of<br>
>>>>>> Pynchon's work. That means we've all put a lot of time into reading and<br>
>>>>>> re-reading and discussing his work. Plenty of people here are ready at any<br>
>>>>>> time to jump into discussions of meaning and interpretation, e.g. all of the<br>
>>>>>> supportive response to Mike Jing's translation efforts.<br>
>>>>>> Serious questions always, or usually, anyway, receive serious<br>
>>>>>> responses. On the other hand, questions that have to do with details that<br>
>>>>>> can, and only in my humble opinion, should, be discovered by a serious<br>
>>>>>> reading of the text, are likely to be met with silly answers, or, as would<br>
>>>>>> have been better in the present case, on my part, no answer.<br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 2:15 PM, David Morris <<a href="mailto:fqmorris@gmail.com">fqmorris@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>>> wrote:<br>
>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>> Are you trying to sound silly? If so, good job!<br>
>>>>>>> David Morris<br>
>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>> On Tuesday, January 3, 2017, Bruno Nogueira <<a href="mailto:bruno.laze@gmail.com">bruno.laze@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>>>> wrote:<br>
>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>> It is very pleasing to fill gaps in memory with imagination!<br>
>>>>>>>> But you are right, Keith. I have lots of reading to do, as always.<br>
>>>>>>>> Don't we all?<br>
>>>>>>>> Even so, someone said that GR should be read the way we listen to<br>
>>>>>>>> jazz. Maybe words (/the music sheet) aren't that important as the soul and<br>
>>>>>>>> abstract meaning (/the phenomenology of music). Our abstract concept of<br>
>>>>>>>> Katje may be more important than the referential details. How do you feel<br>
>>>>>>>> about her? I suspect that, regarding GR, if we don't listen to what we feel,<br>
>>>>>>>> the whole novel implodes (like jazz!): nothing narrated is trustworthy, is<br>
>>>>>>>> it? Like the old hippie said: "I don't have words. I have a soul."<br>
>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>> Katje is a spy? She works for whom? Us or Them?...<br>
>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>> 2017-01-03 11:21 GMT-06:00 David Morris <<a href="mailto:fqmorris@gmail.com">fqmorris@gmail.com</a>>:<br>
>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>> Yeah, I don't remember things the way Bruno tells them...<br>
>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>> David Morris<br>
>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 11:12 AM, Keith Davis <<a href="mailto:kbob42@gmail.com">kbob42@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:<br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> You have some reading to do.<br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> <a href="http://Www.innergroovemusic.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">Www.innergroovemusic.com</a><br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> On Jan 3, 2017, at 11:54 AM, Bruno Nogueira <<a href="mailto:bruno.laze@gmail.com">bruno.laze@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:<br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> Except that Katjer worked for the Germans, didn't she? My memory<br>
>>>>>>>>>> fails me---I remember one of her first episodes depicting a threesome with<br>
>>>>>>>>>> Blicero and Enzian, at the V2 shack, where they all lived like rats. She was<br>
>>>>>>>>>> then sent by Bliss to London, to spy on the White Visitation.<br>
>>>>>>>>>> Btw, what is the relation between Pirate Prentice, Katje, and<br>
>>>>>>>>>> Slothrop?<br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> Happy new year to you all!<br>
>>>>>>>>>> Bruno<br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>> 2017-01-02 16:53 GMT-06:00 Bob Berg <<a href="mailto:robertberg5125@comcast.net">robertberg5125@comcast.net</a>>:<br>
>>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>>> <a href="https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/teenager-nazi-armed-resistance-netherlands-876?utm_source=dmfb" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.vice.com/en_uk/<wbr>article/teenager-nazi-armed-<wbr>resistance-netherlands-876?<wbr>utm_source=dmfb</a><br>
>>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>>> -<br>
>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-l / <a href="http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.waste.org/mail/?<wbr>list=pynchon-l</a><br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>><br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>> --<br>
>>>>>> <a href="http://www.innergroovemusic.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.innergroovemusic.com</a><br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> --<br>
>>>> <a href="http://www.innergroovemusic.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.innergroovemusic.com</a><br>
>>>><br>
>>><br>
>><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
> <a href="http://www.innergroovemusic.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.innergroovemusic.com</a><br>
><br>
-<br>
Pynchon-l / <a href="http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.waste.org/mail/?<wbr>list=pynchon-l</a><br>
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