GRGR(9) Pointsman/Slothrop

[ckaratnytsky at nypl.org]

     Quoth Andrew re Pointsman's dream:
     
     >Interesting idea linking it to Pirate. Certainly sounds better to me 
     >than all that holy-centre approaching/avoiding stuff but I will have 
     >to think about this. One reason I asked about the dream is that it is 
     >retold in the 2nd person. Who is saying `you this ...' and `you that 
     >...'?
     
     And quoth the pugilistic Polonius Mascaro:
     
     [snip]
     
     >This p.o.v. reveals, in typical Pointsman fashion, how it thinks even 
     >of itself as an *other*; Pointsman sees himself in his dreams as a 
     >subject (or, as Andrew points out, an *object*) of his own awareness
     
     I went back last night and had a look at Pirate's dream in the first 
     chapter.  Interestingly, there is none of the "you this..."  and "you 
     that..." in that sequence -- Pirate experiences the events and, 
     importantly, I think, the *sensations* of the dream directly.  There's 
     no other, no distancing 2nd person filter.  The phrase "an 
     interdiction, from which there is no appeal" on p.137 in the Pointsman 
     section also links to Pirate (only I can't find where else it appears 
     at the moment).  The observation you make, Andrew, about Pointsman's 
     habituation to blankness/whiteness is well done, I think.  I was 
     wondering what to do with that.  You would include the white flowers 
     as another emblem of this habituation, yes?  (This brings to mind 
     Blicero and *his* flower of choice, the lovely enzian.  Hmm, what's 
     all this about flowers, do you think?)
     
     Andrew on question 12 after some snipping:
     
     >the creepiness comes from the fact that Pointsman will [make excuses 
     >to justify his selfish actions] even to the point of destroying 
     >Slothrop's mind. And the comment about losing control really gives 
     >the game away. Anyone who needs to control things around them this 
     >much really has problems. Remember Pynchon's aside at the seance 
     >that `control was always the problem'. He was not talking about 
     >Peter Sachsa. He was talking about the Ned Pointsman's of this 
     >world.[...]
     
     Also, note two things about the last paragraph of p.144:  "There's 
     something here, too transparent and swift to get a hold on--Psi 
     Section might speak of ectoplasms..."  and "Whatever we may find, 
     there can be no doubt that he is, physiologically, historically, a 
     monster.  We must never lose control.  The thought of him lost in the 
     world of men..."
     
     First off, I think there's a pun here (and in the line you cite above, 
     Andrew) on "control."  As in, what kind of control *is* there for an 
     experiment like Slothrop?
     
     Secondly, this image of an on-the-loose transparent blob recalls our 
     friend, that lymphatic monster, the Adenoid, another link to Pirate 
     and chapter one.
     
     Sure glad I had that cigarette after lunch.
     
     Now on to, whoa, this Steely/Tinasky thang.  Boy, RUTHSINGS, I've 
     gotta hand it to you:  You may not post very often, but what you post 
     is "cherce," as Spencer Tracy would say.  (The rest of us would say 
     "choice.")
     
     That Chris