Pynchon & rap

[Jane]

Doug Millison wrote:
> 
> "jbor"
>  Or is it the case that
> *both* the history (and historical allegory) and anachronism are at play in
> the "finite" number of words and marks on the page?

This seems to be correct. Although I would say, finite. 

When the Rev says, "by the sixties" my response, as a reader
of P,  is to think that he may be also alluding to the
1960s. This seems to be supported by discussion that
follows. 

I think the "play" of signifiers might be more easily
discerned if we discuss the  dynamics of those  in dialogue.

> 
> They are at play to the degree that a reader might want to bring them into
> play and then follow Pynchon's text off into a chain of interpretations that
> may or may not have anything to do with what Pynchon actually wrote. Nothing
> wrong with that, of course, the reader is permitted to respond to the text
> any way she wants. 

Yes. Of course this is what we do here all the time. Not
only is there nothing wrong with it, it's lots of fun. I for
one have learned a lot reading these reader responses. 
However, there is text that was written by Mr. Pynchon that
we have in common. When we disagree about things, for
example, does Pynchon allude (favorably, ironically,
allegorically, anachronistically, etc.)   to Rap/Hip-Hop in
M&D, we can at least determine if contradictory responses to
the text are equally supported by the text. 

What is it that may be worn on the head at the wedding if it
ever comes about? 
A pirate? A Gypsy? What is that? 

That being said, 

Robert asks, 

>  Or is it the case that
> *both* the history (and historical allegory) and anachronism are at play in
> the "finite" number of words and marks on the page?

Yes. The History is factual, the religion/music/politics.  

The historical allegory is also, to some extent,  dependent
upon the characters and  their relations. Also upon the
events, historical/political/religious referenced. These, of
course, are compressed, the nesting or whatever term you
prefer of the various tales and echo inside and outside the
text (to other texts and tales and events and persons etc. )
These then may stand for abstract ideas, principles, or
forces, so that the literal happenings here suggest 
parallels (to contemporary life, i.e., 1960, 1980, etc.) and
also function  symbolically.  

Perhaps I should not introduce another text, but I think
both of these essays on 
the film Brazil, a film I think many here are quite familiar
with, may be of interest, not only as they may be applied to
M&D, but also to Pynchon's other novels, other arts,  and to
what is or is not postmodern about them. 





http://www.public.coe.edu/~crdickso/brazil.htm

http://www.csad.cov.ac.uk/IDN/neopraxis/brazil.htm