VLVL The deal

[Otto]

----- Original Message -----
From: "jbor" <jbor at bigpond.com>
To: <pynchon-l at waste.org>
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 10:55 AM
Subject: Re: VLVL The deal


> >>>>> "Before he was to be cut loose, Zoyd had had to stand between
> >>>>> two marshals (*.*) unobserved in the afternoon shade (...)."
> >>>>
> >>>> Well, if you leave out the part about one of them being "his
assailant,
> >>>> Ron, unobserved in the afternoon shade", sure thing I guess.
> >>>
> >>> Of course it's absolutely sure if you leave out "his assailant, Ron".
> >>
> >> And, of course, when you read the text as written by Pynchon the words
> > "his
> >> assailant, Ron, unobserved in the afternoon shade" aren't left out at
all.
> >
> > Yeah, but the question was to which person(s) this "unobserved" is
related
> > to.
>
> Syntactically, it directly relates to Ron, and Ron alone. That's
> incontrovertible.

I'm sorry but it isn't incontrovertible at all. It's just your single
opinion. Surely your English is better than mine, but Joseph Tracy wrote
about this point:

"Ridiculous; there's nothing wrong with Pynchons compact sentences. All 3
are in the shade, unobserved, Zoyd held in humiliation to watch Brock's
triumphal demonstration of ownership."

And he's a native speaker. I fully agree to his view.

> Whether Pynchon intended it to refer to Zoyd and the other
> marshal as well is not possible to say, but if he did then there are a
> number of ways he could have avoided ambiguity to convey that particular
> meaning. That he hasn't done so inclines me to give him the benefit of the
> doubt and accept that he did in fact write what he meant to write.
>

I am convinced too that he wrote what he intended to write, that Zoyd is
standing unobserved in the shade inbetween two officers who are logically in
the shade too. The text doesn't say that Frenesi sees Zoyd.

>
> I think the paragraph reads perfectly well as it's actually written,
without
> deleting words and phrases to make it mean something different:

I agree.

> Ron standing
> in the shade, unobserved by everyone else, a sinister reminder to Zoyd to
> behave.
>
> best

But that's wrong -- you are rewriting the text here. Pynchon never wrote:

> Ron standing
> in the shade, unobserved by everyone else, a sinister reminder to Zoyd to
> behave.
>

But since the VLVL seems to have stopped we could leave it at this point

Otto