anarcho-syndicalists
Jon Clay
clayjon at hotmail.com
Fri Mar 16 03:09:03 CDT 2007
Orwell thought of himself as a member of the
"dissident left," as distinguished from the
"official left," meaning basically the British
Labour party, most of which he had come,
well before the second world war, to regard as
potentially, if not already, fascist. More or less
consciously, he found an analogy between British
Labour and the Communist Party under Stalin -
both, he felt, were movements professing to fight
for the working classes against capitalism, but in
reality concerned only with establishing and
perpetuating their own power. The masses were
only there to be used for their idealism, their class
resentments, their willingness to work cheap and
to be sold out, again and again.
Thomas Pynchon, introduction to "1984"
Orwell was no anarchist, but he was absolutely right about this. And, far
from being pie-in-the-sky, anarchists are the only ones with even half a
clue, politically; as far as I can see, every other form of politics,
including liberalism and social democracy, is shrouded in denial, half-truth
and occasionally outright insanity.
Cheers,
Jon
>From: owner-pynchon-l-digest at waste.org (pynchon-l-digest)
>Reply-To: pynchon-l at waste.org
>To: pynchon-l-digest at waste.org
>Subject: pynchon-l-digest V2 #5314
>Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 02:00:13 -0500
>
>pynchon-l-digest Friday, March 16 2007 Volume 02 : Number
>5314
>
>
>
>Re: A joke with a slow fuse
>Re: The Disgusting English Candy Drill
>Re: The Disgusting English Candy Drill
>Re: AtDTDA (4) 111 Anarcho-syndicalists
>Re: AtDTDA (4) 111 Anarcho-syndicalists
>Anarcho-syndicalists (turned into largely NP) // Popeye question answered
>RE: Anarcho-syndicalists
>RE: Popeye question answered
>Re: Atdtda[4]: Under the Volcano?
>Re: Atdtda[4]: 109.1-23 Summary
>Re: Atdtda [4]: Useful bases, 107-108
>Atdtda [4]: Ongoing dispute, 109-111
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 08:06:06 -0400
>From: Monte Davis <monte.davis at bms.com>
>Subject: Re: A joke with a slow fuse
>
>David Gentle wrote:
>
> > Isn't delta also a Nabokov euphamism?
>
>...not to mention Anais Nin?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 13:13:23 +0000
>From: mikebailey at speakeasy.net
>Subject: Re: The Disgusting English Candy Drill
>
>robinlandseadel, amidships in his post,
>quoted the following:
> > This variation is based on two German folk songs, "I
> >Have So Long Been Away From You" and "Cabbage
> >and Turnips Have Driven Me Away"
>
>for real?
>now that right there seems to be a humorous
>juxtaposition (if that isn't something that
>should go without saying...it was on my 3rd
>pass thru this interesting and informative post
>that I began snickering: possible gas-passing-joke)
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 13:39:44 +0000
>From: mikebailey at speakeasy.net
>Subject: Re: The Disgusting English Candy Drill
>
>Nalline is actually an opiate _antagonist_
>ie passim how about connecting Mrs Quoad's parlor
>and her ministrations to Tyrone as motherly, linking
>her with Nalline, and maybe
>leading in a cluster of associations to
>awakening a deadened conscience via the
>English Candy Drill (dentist's drill, of course,
>and "you know the drill" - as the
>"cleaner" says to the guys in Pulp Fiction before
>hosing them off; and of course woodworking-wise
>one drills preparatory to screwing - which
>pertains to all the ancillary anecdotes stemming
>from Slothrop's amatory adventures, "drilling down"
>through the wacky Brit customs to get to the
>naked scenes) in this (isn't it?),the first time we
>consider Slothrop outside a military setting;
>
>Also, the deceased husband's name, Austin,
>("he was my health" - what are we to make of that?)
>is used in Chaucer to mean St Augustine
>("What sholde he studie, and make him-selven wood,
>Upon a book in cloistre alwey to poure,
>Or swinken with his handes, and laboure,
>As Austin bit? How shal the world be served?
>Lat Austin have his swink to him reserved.
>Therfor he was a pricasour aright" - Canterbury
>Tales, Prologue) and of course Augustine
>wrote on memory, which is also the subject
>of cogitation here, the mysterious way that Mrs Quoad
>and her wormwood tea on his previous visit
>come back to Slothrop's mind when he sets
>foot in her parlor...
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 16:30:15 +0000
>From: robinlandseadel at comcast.net
>Subject: Re: AtDTDA (4) 111 Anarcho-syndicalists
>
> Bryan Snyder:
> I'm a big Chomsky fan and I believe when pinned
> down during Q&As (at least in the past, I know he
> has) proclaimed Anarcho-syndicalism as the proper
> form of a society... very interesting stuff posted.
>
>"Against the Day" makes Anarchy, Big A in a circle, {you can
>see it on the T-shirts and jackets of self-possessed adolescent
>tastemakers, or hardcore punk get-ups and other unforseen
>ikons of political theory encountered whilst wandering to and fro
>from one retail establishment to the next} the central mcguffin
>not only of that novel's inner workings, but for all of Pynchon's
>work. It was there all along, but always, to a certain degree,
>sub rosa.
>
>This little passage from "Murdered by Capitalism" allows
>John Ross to place the our beloved author in a
>hyper-anarchist context:
>
> Sasha Berkman and Timothy Leary
> smoked a joint and got terribly cheery,
> Zippy the Pinhead and the Molly McGuires
> roasted Pigasis over the bonfire,
> "No pork!" Bob Dylan and Ralph Nader protested,
> "Como no!" Sub Marcos and the Sla contested.
> Dorthy Day and the Weather Underground.
> Patty Hearst and Bishop Romero even got down,
> Wilhelm Reich invited Hegel to his orgone box,
> rocked the old philosopher down to his socks,
> Houdini taught George and Jonathan to to disappear,
> Thomas Pynchon polished the last keg of beer. . .
> John Ross: Murdered by Capitalism, pg 343
>
>Mind you, that's a small excerpt from a longer poem
>that manages to go on for quite some pages. Ross
>insinuates (early on in the book) that Pynchon lived
>just down the road from him for a while, and there's
>nothing in "Murdered by Capitalism" that goes contrary
>to the goings on in Against the Day. Also it's funny
>and off-the-wall and offers up an alternate history of
>leftism more closely correspondent to reality than the
>larger story we've been sold all these years.
>
>And Murdered by Capitalism has quite a lovely,
>hopeful ending:
>
> An endless procession
> right into the sun
> where the revolution
> never stops rising.
>
>In this interview, Noam Chomsky describes Anarchism as:
>
> as the libertarian left, and from that point of
> view anarchism can be conceived as a kind of
> voluntary socialism, that is, as libertarian socialist
> or anarcho-syndicalist or communist anarchist, in
> the tradition of, say, Bakunin and Kropotkin and
> others.
>
>Which compares in an interesting way to:
>
> Orwell thought of himself as a member of the
> "dissident left," as distinguished from the
> "official left," meaning basically the British
> Labour party, most of which he had come,
> well before the second world war, to regard as
> potentially, if not already, fascist. More or less
> consciously, he found an analogy between British
> Labour and the Communist Party under Stalin -
> both, he felt, were movements professing to fight
> for the working classes against capitalism, but in
> reality concerned only with establishing and
> perpetuating their own power. The masses were
> only there to be used for their idealism, their class
> resentments, their willingness to work cheap and
> to be sold out, again and again.
> Thomas Pynchon, introduction to "1984"
>
>http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=1854
>
>
> The Relevance of Anarcho-syndicalism
> Noam Chomsky interviewed by Peter Jay
> The Jay Interview, July 25, 1976
>
> QUESTION: Professor Chomsky, perhaps we
> should start by trying to define what is not
> meant by anarchism -- the word anarchy is
> derived, after all, from the Greek, literally
> meaning "no government." Now, presumably
> people who talk about anarchy or anarchism
> as a system of political philosophy don't just
> mean that, as it were, as of January 1st next
> year, government as we now understand it
> will suddenly cease; there would be no police,
> no rules of the road, no laws, no tax collectors,
> no post office, and so forth. Presumably, it
> means something more complicated than that.
>
> CHOMSKY: Well, yes to some of those questions,
> no to others. They may very well mean no
> policemen, but I don't think they would mean no
> rules of the road. In fact, I should say to begin with
> that the term anarchism is used to cover quite a
> range of political ideas, but I would prefer to think
> of it as the libertarian left, and from that point of
> view anarchism can be conceived as a kind of
> voluntary socialism, that is, as libertarian socialist
> or anarcho-syndicalist or communist anarchist, in
> the tradition of, say, Bakunin and Kropotkin and
> others. They had in mind a highly organized form
> of society, but a society that was organized on the
> basis of organic units, organic communities. And
> generally, they meant by that the workplace and
> the neighborhood, and from those two basic units
> there could derive through federal arrangements
> a highly integrated kind of social organization
> which might be national or even international in
> scope. And these decisions could be made over
> a substantial range, but by delegates who are
> always part of the organic community from which
> they come, to which they return, and in which, in
> fact, they live.
>
>http://www.chomsky.info/interviews/19760725.htm
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 16:48:14 +0000
>From: robinlandseadel at comcast.net
>Subject: Re: AtDTDA (4) 111 Anarcho-syndicalists
>
> Bryan Snyder:
> I'm a big Chomsky fan. . . . . .I know he
> has) proclaimed Anarcho-syndicalism as the proper
> form of a society...
>
>
> I think that the industrialization and the advance of
>technology
> raise possibilities for self-management over a broad
>scale that
> simply didn't exist in an earlier period. And that in
>fact this is
> precisely the rational mode for an advanced and complex
> industrial society, one in which workers can very well
>become
> masters of their own immediate affairs, that is, in
>direction and
> control of the shop, but also can be in a position to
>make the
> major, substantive decisions concerning the structure of
>the
> economy , concerning social institutions, concerning
>planning,
> regionally and beyond.
>
>http://www.chomsky.info/interviews/19760725.htm
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 20:34:59 +0000
>From: mikebailey at speakeasy.net
>Subject: Anarcho-syndicalists (turned into largely NP) // Popeye question
>answered
>
>robinlandseadel:
>
> > "Against the Day" makes Anarchy...the central mcguffin
> > not only of that novel's inner workings, but for all of Pynchon's
> > work. It was there all along, but always, to a certain degree,
> > sub rosa.
>
>but a nuanced, sophisticated, Henry-Adams-style
>anarchism, sans rabble-rousing,
>free of denial or self-delusion...
>
>...that sounds too effete, doesn't it?
>
> >... Noam Chomsky describes Anarchism as:
> >
> >...the libertarian left, and from that point of
> > view anarchism can be conceived as a kind of
> > voluntary socialism
>
>I still think what Wilson and Shea said in one
>of the "Illuminatus" appendices (perhaps the
>best part of that stellar work?) was terribly
>insightful: people who prefer to compete form
>the libertarian right, while people who prefer
>to co-operate form the libertarian left...
>
> > The Relevance of Anarcho-syndicalism
> > Noam Chomsky interviewed by Peter Jay
> > The Jay Interview, July 25, 1976
>
>...the tradition of, say, Bakunin and Kropotkin and
> > others. They had in mind a highly organized form
> > of society...the workplace and the neighborhood,
> > and from those two basic units
> > there could derive through federal arrangements
> > a highly integrated kind of social organization
> > which might be national or even international in
> > scope. And these decisions could be made over
> > a substantial range, but by delegates...
>
>But that is representative government!
>Unless you institute a consensus parliamentary
>procedure requiring unanimity at all levels,
>you are going to be stuck with tyranny of the majority,
>enforcement of unpopular decisions and its consequent
>hierarchy, representatives who don't represent
>all their constituents (and, really, how could they?)
>and all the other apparatus of government
>that anarchy was created to dispel.
>
>Not that I'd dismiss anarchosyndicalism completely
>just because of that (though I get more
>excited about radical nonviolence) - there is
>still lots to like in terms of social critique.
>Attempts at formulating non-authoritarian
>schemes are always fun to read, too, both for
>the utopian glow and for practical suggestions
>that can be realized without social upheaval...
>
>http://www.syndicalist.org/ has new and back issues of a
>pretty darn good periodical, which was called
>Libertarian Labor Review at its inception in
>1986, but changed its name to Anarchosyndicalist
>review as the Libertarian Party has begun to
>own the "Libertarian" designation for its
>right-anarchist (competers rather than co-operators)
>views...so the rightists gained control over the name
>by competing...
>anyway, some really good articles in there.
>It's weird that Chomsky doesn't write for them.
>Factoid: I believe that Chomsky still carries
>a red (IWW) card.
>
>- -------------
>Popeye question: in the 60s, the big,
>unshaven villainous guy who altercated with
>our bulging-forearmed spinach-loving mariner
>was called "Brutus" -- I specifically remember
>Popeye's pronunciation as "Brutusk"
>
>However, in my adult life, starting with the
>movie "Animal House", I keep hearing references
>to this character as "Bluto" - it has caused
>me much cognitive dissonance.
>
>What gives? Did They change his name for a reason?
>
>Wikipedia has the scoop:
>After the theatrical Popeye cartoon series
>went out of production in 1957, Bluto's name
>was changed to Brutus because it was believed
>that Paramount Pictures, distributors of the
>Fleischer Studios (later Famous Studios) cartoons,
>owned the rights to the name "Bluto"[1].
>"Brutus" appears in the 1960-1962 Popeye television
>cartoons, but he is again "Bluto" in the 1978
>Hanna-Barbera Popeye series and the 1980 Popeye
>movie. Brutus was also the name Nintendo used for
>their arcade game based on the property.
>
>Prior to the name change to Brutus, the bearded
>strongman was known as "The Big Guy Who Hates
>Popeye", "Mean Man" and "Sonny Boy" in the comic
>strip and comic books. The name "Brutus" was first
>used on Popeye related products in 1960 and in print
>in 1962. It is generally accepted that Bluto and
>Brutus are one and the same. However, Ocean Comics
>published a one-shot "Popeye" comic book where Bluto
>and Brutus were twin brothers. Bobby London, who drew
>the "Popeye" daily strip for six years, wrote and
>illustrated "The Return of Bluto" story where the
>1932 version of Bluto returns and discovers a number
>of fat, bearded bullies have taken his place,
> calling themselves "Brutus" (each one being
>a different version of Popeye's rival).
>
>Oh. Ah.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 21:11:43 +0000
>From: robinlandseadel at comcast.net
>Subject: RE: Anarcho-syndicalists
>
> mikebailey:
> But that is representative government!
> Unless you institute a consensus parliamentary
> procedure requiring unanimity at all levels,
> you are going to be stuck with tyranny of the majority,
> enforcement of unpopular decisions and its consequent
> hierarchy, representatives who don't represent
> all their constituents (and, really, how could they?)
> and all the other apparatus of government
> that anarchy was created to dispel.
>
>Somehow this is reminding me of a Firesign routine from
>"Don't Crush That Dwarf, Hand Me the Pliers":
>
>". . . .How much is this worth! What do I hear?"
>"Why, this is metaphysically absurd! How can I know what you hear?"
>"Yeah, fuck you!!!"
>"I heard that!"
>
>I think the real point has to do with the degree of democratic influence
>each individual person could have access to and the good that could
>come from decentralizing government power and influence. As far as
>I can tell, anarchism is really about spreading governemental power
>around more equally and is very much in keeping with the intentions
>on many of our country's founding fathers. I am interested in Anarchism,
>have had many encounters and involvements with people calling
>themselves Anarchists (including my first wife), worked (very happily)
>within self-described anarchist organizations (yeah, I know---that's
>the ultimate oxymoron) but cannot honestly call myself an anarchist.
>And, yeah, Anarchism's a bit in coo-koo-cloudland, but I've always
>enjoyed my stays in their aeries. In any case, Anarchism's all over AtD.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 21:26:29 +0000
>From: robinlandseadel at comcast.net
>Subject: RE: Popeye question answered
>
>Response A:
>In my "Animated Tarot"---nothing physically manifest, mind you,
>just Major Arcana as filtered through Saturday Morning Cartoons
>on the Tube---the Devil card (15) is rendered in the style of Max
>Fleischer's cartoons, with Bluto's black aura looming over the
>chained pair of Popeye and Olive Oyl.
>
>Response B;
>Gawd, I love Bobby London's stuff:
>
>http://www.dirtyduck.com/
>
>http://lambiek.net/artists/l/london_bobby.htm
>
>http://www.comic-art.com/intervws/londart.htm
>
>
> mikebailey:
> Popeye question: in the 60s, the big,
> unshaven villainous guy who altercated with
> our bulging-forearmed spinach-loving mariner
> was called "Brutus" -- I specifically remember
> Popeye's pronunciation as "Brutusk"
>
> However, in my adult life, starting with the
> movie "Animal House", I keep hearing references
> to this character as "Bluto" - it has caused
> me much cognitive dissonance.
>
> What gives? Did They change his name for a reason?
>
> Wikipedia has the scoop:
> After the theatrical Popeye cartoon series
> went out of production in 1957, Bluto's name
> was changed to Brutus because it was believed
> that Paramount Pictures, distributors of the
> Fleischer Studios (later Famous Studios) cartoons,
> owned the rights to the name "Bluto"[1].
> "Brutus" appears in the 1960-1962 Popeye television
> cartoons, but he is again "Bluto" in the 1978
> Hanna-Barbera Popeye series and the 1980 Popeye
> movie. Brutus was also the name Nintendo used for
> their arcade game based on the property.
>
> Prior to the name change to Brutus, the bearded
> strongman was known as "The Big Guy Who Hates
> Popeye", "Mean Man" and "Sonny Boy" in the comic
> strip and comic books. The name "Brutus" was first
> used on Popeye related products in 1960 and in print
> in 1962. It is generally accepted that Bluto and
> Brutus are one and the same. However, Ocean Comics
> published a one-shot "Popeye" comic book where Bluto
> and Brutus were twin brothers. Bobby London, who drew
> the "Popeye" daily strip for six years, wrote and
> illustrated "The Return of Bluto" story where the
> 1932 version of Bluto returns and discovers a number
> of fat, bearded bullies have taken his place,
> calling themselves "Brutus" (each one being
> a different version of Popeye's rival).
>
> Oh. Ah.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 00:35:38 +0000
>From: mikebailey at speakeasy.net
>Subject: Re: Atdtda[4]: Under the Volcano?
>
>If you were referring to the 1984 movie
>based on Malcolm Lowrey's novel _Under
>the Volcano_ I'd like to wonder if that's
>worth a view (or a read) if I can find it?
>
>Happy Traum, I think, wrote a great fingerpicking
>piece by that title which I learned to pick at
>one point...
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 00:45:14 +0000
>From: mikebailey at speakeasy.net
>Subject: Re: Atdtda[4]: 109.1-23 Summary
>
>Michel wrote
> > 2. Lots of activity by employees of Chums of Chance Logistical Services
> > -- all is done for the boys-- by "Oriental laborers" (109.8) --they will
> > shortly leave for "South Africa, most likely" (109.17) --to the Boer
>War?
>
>Vast (and exploited) Chinese labor pool later mentioned by Fleetwood Vibe's
>friend Yitzhak in Africa (167).
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 01:14:53 +0000
>From: mikebailey at speakeasy.net
>Subject: Re: Atdtda [4]: Useful bases, 107-108
>
> > Reading these pages reminds us of other Indian Ocean islands that have
>been
> > in the news these past years: the Chagos Islands.
> >
> > http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,,2005984,00.html
> > http://www.johnpilger.com/page.asp?partid=351
> >
>
>that's horrifying. Surely an aberration from benevolent
>US military policy?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 05:44:19 -0000
>From: "Paul Nightingale" <isread at btopenworld.com>
>Subject: Atdtda [4]: Ongoing dispute, 109-111
>
>The new section brings "political instability" and a threat to the
>established authority of Randolph and Lindsay. There is passing reference
>to
>the assassinated President McKinley: as with the earlier appearance of
>Franz
>Ferdinand (45, passim) the text does not make it (ie assassination)
>explicit, but McKinley, like FF, is closely tied to any discussion of
>anarchism at that time. Anarchism has been described repeatedly as anti- or
>un-American, an alien virus: hence the narrative importance of the "ongoing
>dispute over the choice of a new figurehead for the ship". The section
>begins with a reference to "[m]ealtimes lately" before identifying the
>"ongoing dispute": the implication is that this detail has been missing
>from
>the distant overview provided at the end of the previous section, when "the
>boys" were described so generally. In narrative terms, then, the general
>description glosses over, or suppresses, any reference to the kind of
>conflict now described in detail: just as a "figurehead" serves the
>symbolic
>function of providing consensus by erasing reference to possible sources of
>conflict within the community.
>
>The "ongoing dispute" is also inseparable from a rare reference to ageing
>among the ageless Chums: Darby's voice "ha[s] changed, its charmingly
>insubordinate tone ... darkened to something more considered and, to that
>degree, disquieting" (109-110). Ageing is one indication that the Chums
>inhabit something that might pass for 'the real world' where 'rules of
>nature' are unavoidable. Darby, one might add, has now been distanced
>somewhat from his 'natural' companion, "the reliably humorous Chick
>Counterfly", although the text reminds us of their earlier, easy,
>camaraderie with their shared enthusiasm for the "curvaceous" figurehead
>(109) and their mockery of Lindsay (110).
>
>In keeping with their status, Randolph opts for "a safe and patriotic
>choice"; Miles "[doesn't] care ... as long as it was something to eat"; and
>Lindsay "argue[s] as always for pure abstraction". This is the kind of
>characterisation that established and differentiated the Chums at the
>beginning of the novel: hence, the narrative returns us to the heady
>optimism of the earlier novels in order to undercut it. The text notes that
>"[t]he figurehead debate, at first no deeper than varying decorative tastes
>might account for, had grown bitter and complex", providing opportunities
>"to exchange shoves and, not infrequently, blows". Such opportunities are
>"pretexts" as though conflict cannot be directly acknowledged.
>
>The section concludes with Miles' odd behaviour, a loss of perspective
>perhaps, a withdrawal from the conflict surrounding him: after all he makes
>no contribution to the "figurehead debate". In all of this, the leadership
>of Randolph, and the authoritarian control exercised by Lindsay, appear
>neutralised: Lindsay has had no response to Darby's "danged shipboard
>politics" outburst (109) and the subsequent mockery of Darby and Chick.
>
>------------------------------
>
>End of pynchon-l-digest V2 #5314
>********************************
>
>To unsubscribe, send a message to waste at waste.org
>with "unsubscribe pynchon-l-digest" in the message body.
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Hotmail is evolving - check out the new Windows Live Mail
http://ideas.live.co.uk
More information about the Pynchon-l
mailing list