ATDTDA (33) - p. 921-2 - anarchism

[braam van bruggen]

Also, some people thought anarchism was about individual moral 
responsibility.
We take responsibility back from the state. There is a very serious 
connection
here to Aleister Crowley....

Braam

Original Message ----- From: <kelber at mindspring.com>
To: <pynchon-l at waste.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 12:01 AM
Subject: Fw: RE: ATDTDA (33) - p. 921-2 - anarchism


>
> Jill, I don't think we should worry about spoilers either, at this point. 
> Spoil away!  Which pages are you referring to?
>
> Ewball/Pynchon make the point that while anarchists may be opposed to all 
> forms of government, that doesn't mean that they're opposed to rules. 
> Ewball's laying out an anarchist's moral code.  Other's have disagreed 
> with this, but I think Pynchon regards Webb Traverse as a solid (if 
> flawed) good-guy -- the fact that he's blowing up train tracks instead of 
> trains is evidence of that.  Good anarchists abide by Ewball's code: 
> slaughter the guilty, not the innocent.  By not slaughtering Scarsdale 
> Vibe, the Traverse sons may or may not be good, but they're not 
> anarchists.
>
> Laura
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: "grladams at teleport.com" <grladams at teleport.com>
>
>>
>>Is this Pynchon'€™s opinion?
>>I think this is the question in every book. Is Pynchon siding with the
>>subversive rebel elements or does he just describe them really well? Would
>>Pynchon's acquaintance with heresy have anything to do with an answer? As 
>>a
>>side note, Lovecraft scholars gathered a lot of biographical details on
>>him. In the intro to Mountains of Madness facts I read pointed to his real
>>fear of a mass revolution, a fondness for a prim order. I think that
>>Pynchon has a bit of this in him too! I am basing this idea on pages in 
>>the
>>future. If spoilers were allowed, (and they should be at this point) I'd
>>type it out.
>>Reading her post again, I may need to fine tune. Does Pynchon think that
>>revolutionaries should be professional about subverting? Then YES I do
>>think this is one of his opinions.
>>Jill
>>
>>Laura writes:
>>
>>Ewball gives his take on anarchists and their reputation as bomb-chuckers:
>>
>>"'There's plenty of folks who deserve to be blown up, to be sure,' opined
>>>Ewball, 'but they've got to be gone after in a professional way, anything
>>>else is being just like them, slaughterin the innocent, when what we need
>>>is more slaughterin of the guilty.  Who gave the orders, who carried 'em
>>>out, exact names and whereabouts – and then go get 'em.  That'd be just
>>>honest soldiering.'"
>>>
>>>Is this Pynchon’s opinion?  I think it is, personally.  At least it's 
>>>an
>>>attitude that he has some sympathy for.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Ewball continues:
>>>
>>>"' … the real nihilists are working for the owners, 'cause it's them 
>>>that
>>>don't believe in shit, our dead to them are nothing but dead, just one 
>>>more
>>>Bloody Shirt to wave at us, keep us doin what they want, but our dead 
>>>never
>>>stopped belonging to us, they haunt us every day, don't you see, and we 
>>>got
>>>to stay true, they wouldn't forgive us if we wandered off the trail.'"
>>>
>>>This really gets to Frank.  It's been six years since he shot Sloat, and
>>>Deuce, Vibe and Lake (whom Frank considers a collaborator) are still out
>>>there.  He *has* wandered off the trail.
>>>
>>>
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>
>
>