VLVL (13) - Cesare Lombroso/Edukators

[kelber at mindspring.com]

This reminds me of a German film that came out a few years ago, The Edukators [great movie, by the way], about some young, idealistic politicos who kidnap a banker only to find out that he used to be an idealistic lefty.  The punchline of the movie is:  some people never change.  The odd thing is, there are two versions of the movie:  one with, one without a final brief image.  Turns out that image completely affects how you interpret the final line.  Seems that who Frenesi really is may be equally dependent on fleeting glimpses of her.

Laura

-----Original Message-----
>From: Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>

>
>I find it more like real life . People and their motives are not made  
>credible so much by some impossibly literary inner narrative as by  
>what they do, no matter how odd. I find the behaviors credible after  
>seeing the weird directions lives took coming out of the 60s. Pynchon  
>focuses on behavior. Inner narratives are short and often digressive.  
>Some of the neocons were once radical lefties, and where did all  
>those dittoheads come from? People change , often suddenly.  The  
>suddenness of Frenesi's turn is hard to fathom and pushes credibility  
>but we are talking about sex, drugs, power, unmet needs. Who has not  
>toyed with betrayal or stepped over that line in some form?
>Vonds theory of the radicals secret need for order is being played  
>out with Frenesi, while her theory that there is an inner beauty/ 
>vulnerability/relationship to be found in the wealth and protection  
>of the state is played out with Vond. Both Ideas are stupid and  
>uncrushable dreams, TV fantasies. The difference is that Frenesi has  
>a reality base which is her mother, but her mother has the same  
>attraction to the uniform/security. These seem like classic male  
>female weaknesses/traits and they appear in many forms  and degrees  
>in the book.
>
>The dreams are in the mind. Reality disappoints and turns things in a  
>sado-masochistic direction.
>
>On Mar 10, 2009, at 4:20 PM, David Morris wrote:
>
>> I see discussion of VL like this as proof of the book's failure as
>> viable fiction:  desperate attempts to imbue the characters with
>> understandable motives where none are apparent in the text.
>>
>> No need to respond.  I'm voiced this criticism of VL before.  Carry
>> on, and I'll continue to try avoiding VLVL posts.
>>
>> David Morris
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 3:06 PM, Richard Ryan  
>> <richardryannyc at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Vond is both repugnant and charismatic.  He *has* to be  
>>> charismatic if we're going to understand Frenesi's love for him  
>>> (assuming "love" and not mere animal attraction is the right way  
>>> to describe her feelings....)
>