Heresy

[Bekah]

I remember reading eons ago,  another lifetime,  that the experience  
of LSD was similar to that of  schizophrenia.    Current research  
shows that it apparently doesn't do that,  but it does do something a  
bit similar.    If a similar experience is found in nature,  perhaps  
there are people who can get into an LSD-like trip without the drug.    
Some might even be able to control it but that's another thing about  
LSD,  it's not about control.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23270344-23109,00.html

Bekah



On Sep 13, 2009, at 5:25 PM, Keith wrote:

>> On Sep 13, 2009, at 3:28 PM, Page wrote:
>>
>>> Discussing experiences on LSD falls into the philosophers'  
>>> category of
>>> non-propositional knowledge. That is, knowledge that cannot be  
>>> passed on
>>> verbally.
>
> Thinking about that a bit, and getting Alice's lovely poem, I  
> realized that
> your statement is not accurate. Non-propositional knowledge is  
> knowledge
> that cannot be passed on propositionally. There are ways of passing on
> knowledge verbally that do not require declarative or literal  
> verbalizations.
> It does require the listener to have a certain openness, unless one  
> is gifted
> enough to use language in a rather forceful manner. Pynchon actually  
> is, if
> you open yourself to it, and many here are.
>
> And, with all due respect to the other-ness of the LSD experience,  
> there are
> ways of getting way outside ordinary consciousness that do not  
> require ingestion
> of anything. I was tripping as a youngster using what I now would  
> call thought
> experiments. And, with apologies for indulging in condescension,  
> I've always thought,
> "Jesus Christ, if you need psychedelics, you aren't paying close  
> enough attention."
>
> I know that last sentence will evoke ire, but that's what I meant by  
> my assertion,
>
> "You don't know what I'm not missing."
>
> But, it's true. Hesse has a beautiful assertion of this in his  
> autobiographical writings.
> Might be online somewhere, let me check.
>
> Not anywhere I can find. It's on page 142 of my old copy of  
> Autobiographical Writings, in the essay, 'A Guest at the Spa.' It'll  
> piss many off, too. So, don't read it, and yell at me. But, while  
> I'm intelligent enough to know that I can't say anything about the  
> acid experience without taking acid. Neither can anyone assert that  
> I am missing something because I haven't taken it. It is possible  
> that I have entered psychedelic states without it. And have spent  
> the better part of a half century studying everything I can get my  
> hands on to understand what those experiences were/are and how they  
> could be triggered by certain intense trains of thought. The first  
> time I smoked hash it blew my mind. It took me right to the place  
> I'd been visiting since childhood. The thought of taking anything  
> more powerfully psychedelic seemed unnecessary, and, yes,  
> frightening. Maybe when I'm told I'm going to die shortly, I'll drop  
> some acid and see what it does to where I've already been.
>
> You can warp the apparatus without taking a damned thing.

http://web.mac.com/bekker2/