anyone see a Mason & Dixon resonance here?

[Ian Livingston]

I never understood the quick leap to homoeroticism. My take is that it
is largely projection. Are all women friends unconsumated lesbians,
too? Our society is in deep shit if every friendship is Freudian when
everyone who puts a good, solid half hour of research into it knows
Freud's methods and conclusions were unsupported and thoroughly
mistaken. Then again, maybe the wish that Freud's oversimplifications
were acceptable that has contributed to put our society into such deep
shit....

On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 4:10 PM,  <malignd at aol.com> wrote:
> Read Leslie Fiedler's Love and Death in the American Novel for a rich
> discusision of unconsumated homoerotic love as an enduring theme in American
> fiction.  Two men lighting out across the country.  It doesn't begin with
> Pycnhon.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
> To: Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com>
> Cc: pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org>; me <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> Sent: Thu, Feb 4, 2010 12:52 am
> Subject: Re: anyone see a Mason & Dixon resonance here?
>
>
> And don't forget the Baghavad-Gita, Huck and Nigger Jim, Batman andRobin,
> Friday and Gannon....On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 11:01 PM, Mark Kohut
> <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:>> I know two guys doing stuff in a novel, any
> fiction, must go further> back than I have ever read. (Iliad? NOT Genesis,
> but yes Gilgamesh, right?)>> Up thru many we can name BUT, to set de
> Tocqueville off with another character as they travel America sure seems to
> suggest Carey has read M & D, I'd say.>>>>>>>>>>>> OFF THEY GO>> Jan 28th
> 2010>>>>>> PARROT AND OLIVIER IN AMERICA. By Peter Carey. KNOPF; 452>>
> PAGES;>> $26.95. FABER AND FABER; GBP18.99. Buy from Amazon.com[1],>>
> Amazon.co.uk[2]>>>> UNIVERSALLY celebrated as a classic when it was first>>
> published in>> 1835, Alexis de Tocqueville's "Democracy in America">>
> nevertheless>> suffered from long years in the shadows. The centenary of>>
> the author's>> birth in 1905 went uncelebrated. No new edition of the book>>
> appeared>> between 1913 and 1945. The best that Tocqueville got was>> the
> occasional>> reference in a learned footnote.>>>> Today Tocqueville is
> revered as never before. The>> bicentennial of his>> birth was the occasion
> for academic bacchanalias on both>> sides of the>> Atlantic. No fewer than
> four new editions of "Democracy">> have appeared>> in the past decade. Books
> on the great man pour from the>> printing>> presses, ranging in quality from
> ponderous academic tomes>> to Hugh>> Brogan's delightful biography.>>>> Now
> we have an unexpected addition to the Tocqueville>> renaissance: a>>
> fictional account of his visit to the United States by a>> much garlanded>>
> novelist. "Parrot and Olivier" has all the quirky qualities>> that we>> have
> come to expect from Peter Carey: a winding narrative,>> a mass of>> vivid
> historical detail, and some very lively writing.>>>> The story of
> Tocqueville's visit was an extraordinary one>> in its own>> right. He was
> only 25 when he crossed the Atlantic,>> dispatched by the>> French
> government to study America's penal system. But as>> he travelled>> around
> the new country Tocqueville became obsessed with the>> idea that>> he was
> witnessing the future in the making, the rise of a>> new>> democratic world.
> A treatise on prisons became a meditation>> on the new>> world order.>>>>
> This extraordinary tale is rendered even more extraordinary>> in Mr>>
> Carey's retelling. The author tells his story through the>> eyes of two>>
> characters. Olivier is his version of Tocqueville--a French>> aristocrat>>
> haunted by the horrors of the revolution and the glories of>> the world>> it
> destroyed ("the fine powder on the men's wigs, the>> lovely perfumes>> on
> the ladies breasts, the extraordinary palette of the>> ancient regime,>>
> such pinks and greens, gorgeous silks and satins whose>> colours rose and>>
> fell among the folds and melted into the candlelight").>> Parrot is an>>
> itinerant English printer who--thanks to an>> over-complicated plot--ends>>
> up as Olivier's servant-cum-minder. The narrative shifts>> constantly>>
> between the perspectives of the travelling duo.>>>> The leading characters
> are beautifully drawn. Olivier is a>> fastidious>> prig and congenital
> hypochondriac. Parrot is an English>> radical--he>> reads Tom Paine and
> spits on the ancient regime--who is>> obsessed by>> art. Olivier is
> initially repulsed by America but falls in>> love with a>> saucy American
> woman, and hence with the country. Parrot>> finds a home>> and a business in
> America.>>>> Mr Carey's parallel storytelling provides him with more>> than
> just a way>> of exploring two idiosyncratic heroes. It allows him to>> offer
> shifting>> perspectives on the third character in this book--America>>
> itself.>> Olivier moves in what boorish Americans regard as civilised>>
> society.>> Parrot is at home in the artistic demimonde. The result is>> a
> gripping>> portrait of Jacksonian America in all its wild variety,>> from
> its model>> farms to its grungy boarding-houses, from its Fourth of>> July
> parades to>> its filthy streets full of copulating pigs.>>>> "Parrot and
> Olivier" is a wonderful tribute to>> Tocqueville's great>> book. But it is
> more than that: it is also a counterblast.>> One of>> Tocqueville's greatest
> fears was that democracy would kill>> great art.>> Everything would be
> reduced to the dismal level of>> democratic man.>> Parrot dismisses this
> fear as a phantom. "There are no sans>> culottes,>> nor will there ever be
> again. There is no tyranny in>> America, nor ever>> could be," he says to
> his master. "Your bleak certainty>> that there can>> be no art in a
> democracy is unsupported by truth." Which>> points to a>> wonderful paradox:
> the very fact that we now revere>> Tocqueville to the>> point of writing
> novels about him is proof that one of his>> guiding>> ideas about the evils
> of democracy was bunkum, if>> magnificent bunkum.>>>> ----->> [1]
> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0307592626/theeconomists-20>> [2]>>
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0571253296/economistshop-21>>>>>>>>
> See this article with graphics and related items at
> http://www.economist.com/books/displaystory.cfm?story_id=15391378&fsrc=rss>>>>
> Go to http://www.economist.com for more global news, views>> and analysis
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