V-2nd

[Mitchell Nisonoff]

... and when references to all humans invariably will be "man" (sing.) or "mankind," but not "men" (pl.).



----- Original Message ----
From: Mitchell Nisonoff <mitchnis at yahoo.com>
To: Jude Bloom <jude.bloom at gmail.com>
Cc: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>; "page at quesnelbc.com" <page at quesnelbc.com>; Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com>; pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org>
Sent: Tue, June 15, 2010 5:03:42 PM
Subject: Re: V-2nd

Thanks, I think.

I previously wrote:

> "(Inanimate objects could do what they wanted. [Here he corrects what he said just before:]  Not what they wanted because things do not want; only men.  But things do what they do..."  (pp. 19-20)
> 
> Here, TRP is making some non-subtle equivalence between inanimate objects and women. 

You inquired:  Are we sure, though, that when he says things do not want, only men, that he's not saying mankind (as in, in days ago, all humans)?

I would say not, especially given, as a number of you already have pointed out, that Rachel -- a specific woman -- also is being referenced as being inanimate.  He is now proposing that Rachel does what she does as an inanimate object does (as distinguished from men, who will do what they want).



----- Original Message ----
From: Jude Bloom <jude.bloom at gmail.com>
To: Mitchell Nisonoff <mitchnis at yahoo.com>
Cc: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>; "mitchnis at yahoo.com" <mitchnis at yahoo.com>; "page at quesnelbc.com" <page at quesnelbc.com>; Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com>; pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org>
Sent: Tue, June 15, 2010 4:50:42 PM
Subject: Re: V-2nd

Now that's what I call an answer. Where the hell were you when I suffered through Freshman Lit?

Are we sure, though, that when he says things do not want, only men, that he's not saying mankind (as in, in days ago, all humans)?



Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 15, 2010, at 1:55 PM, Mitchell Nisonoff <mitchnis at yahoo.com> wrote:

> TRP's ready and distinguishing use of Yiddish slang is, to this day, a shorthand badge of New York's Upper West Siders -- irrespective of religion.  His spellings indicate a phonetic familiarity with the words:
> 
> "Benny Profane, a schlemihl..."  (p. 1)
> 
> "It semed sometimes that he put himself deliberately in the way of hostile objects, as if he were looking to get schlimazzeled out of existence."
> 
> "Only something, being a schlemihl, he'd known for years: inanimate objects and he could not live in peace." (p. 32)
> 
> (A standard distinguishment between "schlemiel" and "schimazel" is:
> A schlemiel is one who always spills his soup, schlimazel is the one on
> whom it always lands.)
> 
> See also Latinoisms-slang:
> 
> "Maricon" (p. 33)
> "Nueva York" (p. 38)
> 
> TRP also clearly has imbibed much from Jewish community and Jewish religious sources.
> 
> Profane is "half Catholic" but his mother is Jewish (p. 12), making him a Jew under Jewish law.
> 
> The Catskills is a clear reference to the Jewish summer retreat area.  New York's "Route 17" is a main road to the Catskills.
> 
> The "Five Towns" on the south shore of Long Island is notorious since at least the 50's for its heavily Jewish population.  Rachel is a clear Biblical name; she came for the Five Towns and so is immediately identiable as a Jewess.  (Cf. "Maybe,"said Profane, "we can try it next time with a fig leaf." (p. 17).)
> 
> That the "blood of this kingdom" "divert themselves among seemingly endless vistas of butterfly shrimp and egg foo young" (p. 19) is hilarious in some part because shrimp clearly is not kosher according to Jewish dietary laws.  "Pig Bodine" also is clearly treyf.
> 
> He is explict in his use of Jewish biblical reference here, which also shows respect/admiration for Jewish people:
> 
> "He felt like the Angel of Death, marking the doors of tomorrow's victimes in blood.  The purpose of a mezuzah was to fake the Angel out so he'd pass by.  On these hundred of so cabins Profane didn't see mezuzah one.  So much the worse."    [No Jews:  ugh.]  (p. 23)
> 
> Cf. prior reference to "mezuzah" on p. 16.
> 
> I think that this subtle(?) emphases on Jews/Judaism in the first chapter of V. gives a clue that the Kabbalah (leaned on heavily in GR) informs TRP's views on inanimacy:
> 
> "(Inanimate objects could do what they wanted. [Here he corrects what he said just before:]  Not what they wanted because things do not want; only men.  But things do what they do..."  (pp. 19-20)
> 
> Here, TRP is making some non-subtle equivalence between inanimate objects and women.  Feminist he wasn't.
> 
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
> To: Jude Bloom <jude.bloom at gmail.com>
> Cc: Page <page at quesnelbc.com>; Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com>; pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org>
> Sent: Mon, June 14, 2010 11:49:52 AM
> Subject: Re: V-2nd
> 
>> By the way: what's all the Jewish stuff in V.?  Don't know if it keeps up,
>> reading it for the first time here.
>> 
> 
> Israel was quite a controversy at the time. Just becoming a nation and
> looking for American support. And many, many new European Jewish
> immigrants and their children just arriving on the American scene. It
> was a pretty hot topic, replete with cultural ramifications galore.
> 
> On Sun, Jun 13, 2010 at 5:25 PM, Jude Bloom <jude.bloom at gmail.com> wrote:
>> That is some fucked-up shit. Tooth pain isn't like normal pain. Its direct
>> proximity to the brain... teeth have hot electrical wires poking right into
>> the soft grey matter... and as Martin Amis has said, your mouth is where you
>> live.
>> 
>> In fact the whole subject of writers and teeth is pretty interesting. Amis,
>> Joyce, Nabokov... all epic tooth sufferers.
>> 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Jun 13, 2010, at 2:52 PM, "Page" <page at quesnelbc.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Closer reality connection: when I was growing up, the family dentist had
>>> been a Navy dentist during WWII. I can testify to the man's lack of
>>> interest
>>> in whether he was causing pain. At some point I had two wisdom teeth
>>> extracted. Asked him about pain control, and he said, "Wait at least two
>>> hours. If it still hurts, take two aspirin." Pretty much shot the rest of
>>> that day and all of that night.
>>> 
>>> Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Reality connection: I have heard a couple of military teeth damage work
>>> done to foax in my time......
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
> 
> 
> 
> --"liber enim librum aperit."
> 
> 
> 
> 
>