The Recognitions and V.

[Paul Mackin]

On 6/12/2011 4:11 PM, Ian Livingston wrote:
> Ah, yes, I agree that the Virgin and the Middle Ages seem idyllic in
> Adams. But, virginal, in Pynchon? I am not so sure. None of his women,
> even if virginal, seem to imply a pre-coital integrity. Even "St.
> Fina" is a flawed, horny little vixen whose sexual allure is the
> nature of her power over the Playboys. And Victoria Wren is a rather
> sultry little manipulator whose tumble with Goodfellow seems of
> relatively minor consequence.
As Charlie Harper would say, that's a little harsh.

It wasn't the Virgin's being virginal that Adams' admiration and maybe 
Pynchon's too was based upon.

The Virgin was a Goddess , whom the people virtually worshiped.

It was one of the things people agreed upon, and were inspired by.

It's true, Goddesses were traditionally virgins, but that was never 
their main claim to fame.

Just thought I  ought to put in a good word for Victoria Wren.


P





>   If there is a unity implied in V. it
> seems to me it is the illusory unity of the node of the v such as that
> of parallel lines intersecting at the horizon. The unity is only
> apparent to the readily deceived senses of one perspective, the lines
> do not in actuality meet, and everything continues as it always has,
> in dependence upon everything else, yet subjectively discrete, alien
> from any sort of integrated totality. And Malta? Malta echoes the
> knights for Pynchon, not the Goddess. It is the nexus of dynamic
> activity in the Med, though not causally related to any of its
> conflicts. It echoes the violence of the times, not their integrity.
>
> Of course, I must stick to my guns, too, about imputing intention to
> an author. Pynchon was brilliant, but young at the time he was writing
> V. He may have had only glimpses of the complexity evident in his
> later work; may have been drawn like an eye along those converging
> lines, still in pursuit of a unity the search for which he came only
> later to abandon. All this anti-lapsarianism may have more to do with
> my own delving into theism and paranoia as linked intuitive attitudes
> than with Pynchon's intentions, perspectives, or attitudes.
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 12, 2011 at 12:14 PM, Mark Kohut<markekohut at yahoo.com>  wrote:
>> There is Malta as a still-strong echoic embodiment of Adams'
>> Middle Ages, the Virgin before the Dynamo.......
>>
>> Adams Virgin is one of the major meanings of V....and his
>> world, lost to Pynchon, as to Gaddis, is a thematic foundation, I say.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: Richard Ryan<himself at richardryan.com>
>> To: Ian Livingston<igrlivingston at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Mark Kohut<markekohut at yahoo.com>; pynchon -l<pynchon-l at waste.org>
>> Sent: Sun, June 12, 2011 2:05:42 PM
>> Subject: Re: The Recognitions and V.
>>
>> While I would agree there's nothing in V to suggest a belief in a
>> prelapsarian paradise (as village culture, hunter gatherer societies,
>> whatever) - it also appears that Pynchon - at least the early Pynchon
>> - sees the centripetal forces of entropy and mechanization
>> *accelerating*; the depersonalizing, disintegrating aspects of human
>> history grow more and more ferocious as the powers of techno-violence
>> trend upwards - or downwards, as the case may be.
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 12, 2011 at 1:04 PM, Ian Livingston<igrlivingston at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>> Hm. Do ya think? I haven't read The Recognitions yet, but V. seems to
>>> me to suggest that it has always been a fragmented world. Pynchon
>>> represents history as an Ariadne's thread through an ongoing
>>> Armageddon in which individuals seek ever more tenuous connections as
>>> complexity becomes more evident. The unifying element is memory
>>> itself, rather than recollection of a better unity.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jun 12, 2011 at 9:40 AM, Mark Kohut<markekohut at yahoo.com>  wrote:
>>>> Fragmentation and loss as the overarching meaning of the modern world. Both.
>>>> Belief that the world was once unified and that that was/is felt as a basic
>>>> Good
>>>> Thing.
>>>>
>>>> (Of course, other books, writers, too, I'm sure. Who?)
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> "Less than any man have I  excuse for prejudice; and I feel for all
>>> creeds the warm sympathy of one who has come to learn that even the
>>> trust in reason is a precarious faith, and that we are all fragments
>>> of darkness groping for the sun. I know no more about the ultimates
>>> than the simplest urchin in the streets." -- Will Durant
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Richard Ryan
>> New York and the World
>> ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
>> Thanks to all who saw VTM's new production!
>> "Brilliant!";"Superb!" - NYTheatre-wire.com
>> www.kingstheplay.com
>>
>>
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