Noam Chomsky's statement on killing of Osama bin Laden

[cfabel]

A tad more perhaps but it has always struck me that all "isms" currently at
hand are derivative of European enlightenment thinking and committed largely
to the now defunct idea that ultimate truths are discernable.  All belief
systems disposed to this sort of fancy exhibit an excessive dedication to
essentialism, an intellectual conceit that entails most fundamentally a
definitive rendition of human nature and a subsequent categorization of
people that is implicative of superiority and inferiority for all purposes.
>From this follows, axiomatically, both a revelation concerning what sorts of
arrangements make for utopia and what sorts of methods are necessary for
getting us from here to there, once and for all. As these are essentials,
they are never untrue; and all other propositions, behaviors and practices
must follow as necessities. Each claims, thereby, infallibility, and so all
tend to tyranny of one sort or another; tyranny and eventual failure as no
closed epistemology has yet can coped ultimately with the inevitability of
change .

C. F. Abel
Chair
Department of Government
Stephen F. Austin State University
Nacogdoches, Texas 75962
(936) 468-3903



-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pynchon-l at waste.org [mailto:owner-pynchon-l at waste.org] On Behalf
Of Michael F
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 12:39 AM
To: David Morris
Cc: Richard Ryan; Mark Kohut; pynchon -l
Subject: Re: Noam Chomsky's statement on killing of Osama bin Laden

Dave,

Liberalism is a tad more safe than Progressivism.  Liberalism:
functioning as a cohesive community unit without the influence of nobility
or religion; Progressivism: moving forward toward something that is unknown,
and the "unknown" can be either good or bad, but more than likely
bad(because it is unknown and without previous judgement).
 Somehow I see this all coming back toward Pynchon's writings...
Pynchon's major writings take place during boom's of Progressivism:
birth of the nation, fine de sicle, and baby boomer, Viet Nam-era
California.  Lebowksi-era Southern California?

Mike

On Sun, May 15, 2011 at 2:07 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
> Amen.
> Progressives like Chomsky & Nadar are the liberals that makes liberals 
> ashamed to admit they're liberals. They give limbaugh an easy "Blame 
> Amerca First" target.
>
> On Saturday, May 14, 2011, Richard Ryan <himself at richardryan.com> wrote:
>> Chomsky is, like Nader, a giant figure in the American progressive 
>> movement who has managed to systematically self-destruct in the twilight
of his career.
>>
>> On Fri, May 13, 2011 at 9:10 PM, Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Chomsky argues as if HIS language for things is just like his 
>>> 'discovery' that language is inherent in the mind. Once you've named 
>>> Imperialism, it's always there, even when we pull away (from some 
>>> countries, from some policies, from a lying hidden 
>>> country-conquering foreign policy)
>>>
>>> His linguistics is being challenged as being far more subtle and 
>>> nurture-related than
>>>
>>> Chomsky's hard Platonism seems to allow.
>>>
>>> Chomsky writes:
>>> ..."to extradite bin Laden if they were presented with 
>>> evidence—which, as we soon learned, Washington didn’t have. Thus 
>>> Obama was simply lying when he said, in his White House statement, 
>>> that “we quickly learned that the 9/11 attacks were carried out by al
Qaeda."
>>>
>>> Nothing serious has been provided since. There is much talk of bin 
>>> Laden’s “confession,” but that is rather like my confession that I 
>>> won the Boston Marathon. He boasted of what he regarded as a great
achievement."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> This, to me, is detestable. Grunt workers who had been tracking Bin 
>>> Laden for years KNEW he had done it as soon as it happened. (One 
>>> young writer I know, had requested thru State to interview him in 
>>> 1997. Disallowed) CHOMSKY thinks that the US should have turned over 
>>> EVIDENCE---what would count as evidence for the Taliban? Even IF you 
>>> think we should never have challenged the Taliban with a war, why, 
>>> how, could we have believed their words? Look what they did, 
>>> rulingly, as policy within their own country? Give them the EVIDENCE 
>>> we have? when people with eyes in both--all--- parties, even 
>>> Libertarian, thought there was more than the usual reasons for 
>>> distrust, for believing that if (since?) they were harboring OBL, he 
>>> would get that info?  From Orwell, thru Pynchon, thru Buckley, Mailer or
Vidal, I cannot believe ANY of them would but laugh at Chomsky's notion of
turning over such evidence?
>>>
>>> (A...and, I will bet you we did show them something....Did the 
>>> Taliban demand a trial at the Hague?---say they would turn him over 
>>> for THAT?)
>>>
>>> And, goes his brain-damaged, lingusitics-challenged logic, because 
>>> we WOULD NOT do that, we, the US, had no evidence.????  Think about THAT
a moment.
>>>
>>> Let's see: No, you cannot search my home without a warrant, 
>>> therefore I MUST be guilty....
>>>
>>> To call Obama a liar for the truths---not for any policies----that
ALL know.
>>> Simply Awful To suggest OBL 'just bragged" about all the evil --that 
>>> no one knows who caused it,--, all Al--Queda's own words and 
>>> self-praised deeds, to all who have given bits of evidence--even 
>>> thousands of innocents like the part of bin Laden's family which 
>>> knew and disowned him---- in that tangled evil web
Al--Queda wove.....means Chomsky is BLIND to reality but not his own ideas.
>>>
>>>
>>> Chomsky is a Beckian, Limbaugh mirror of fantasy world 'crazy' 
>>> here....I say Chomsky is in AGAINST THE DAY, if not in The 
>>> Recognitions (but we are coming to some stuff related, maybe)
>>>
>>>
>>> O yes, and Tomahawk is NOT like naming our missiles after our 
>>> victims, such as in that stupid Nazis' analogy...Tomahawk was a 
>>> weapon of those Native Americans, many tribes of which fought bloody 
>>> wars against each other with...........
>>>
>>> Noam, learn how logic is a human 'form of life'....and learn how to 
>>> think like a human being............
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>> From: Michael F <mff8785 at gmail.com>
>>> To: David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> Cc: cfabel <cfabel at sfasu.edu>; Paul Mackin 
>>> <mackin.paul at verizon.net>; "pynchon-l at waste.org" 
>>> <pynchon-l at waste.org>
>>> Sent: Fri, May 13, 2011 1:55:34 PM
>>> Subject: RE: Noam Chomsky's statem--
>> Richard Ryan
>> New York and the World
>> ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
>> Thanks to all who saw VTM's new production!
>> "Brilliant!";"Superb!" - NYTheatre-wire.com www.kingstheplay.com
>>
>