review of Zizek ideas in NY review of books

Paul Mackin mackin.paul at verizon.net
Sat Jun 23 10:20:23 CDT 2012


On 6/23/2012 10:24 AM, Keith Davis wrote:
> On a show no one would watch? (That's a cultural crit. not a personal 
> attack!)

No attack taken :-)

P
>
> On Sat, Jun 23, 2012 at 9:20 AM, Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net 
> <mailto:mackin.paul at verizon.net>> wrote:
>
>     On 6/23/2012 5:06 AM, Matthew Cissell wrote:
>>     Me? Intellectual class? Nah, mediocre grades kept me out. I might
>>     fit in with the church of the subgenius, but ahm not shur 'bout
>>     the dawgma. Ah always figured the dawgma was a bitch.
>>
>>     Yeh, i guess Z gettin the Rob treatment does seem fitting.
>
>     Einstein had mediocre grades I think I might possibly had read
>     somewhere.
>
>     The intellectual class would be people who think deep thoughts
>     about things that don't necessariy relate to defense budgets.
>     America doesn't have such people anymore. Back when it did they
>     went to CCNY and then on to Columbia, Harvard or U. of Chicago. As
>     for grades, their mothers had told them don't bother to bring your
>     report card home if it has anything less than A pluses on it.
>     Today, good grades get you into computer science or biz school. 
>     Europe still has intellectuals.  They go to places like Ecole
>     Normale Superieure .  Do they even bother to have grades in such
>     exulted climes  (you have to pass tests to get in I suppose).  If
>     you're brilliant, everyone picks up on it quickly and thereafter
>     you can write your own ticket--in that small but arguably
>     important world at least.
>
>     Anyway, Matthew, if you're NOT one, you could play one on television.
>
>
>
>     P
>
>
>
>
>>
>>     cheers
>>     mc
>>
>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>     *From:* Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net>
>>     <mailto:mackin.paul at verizon.net>
>>     *To:* pynchon-l at waste.org <mailto:pynchon-l at waste.org>
>>     *Sent:* Friday, June 22, 2012 6:48 PM
>>     *Subject:* Re: review of Zizek ideas in NY review of books
>>
>>     On 6/22/2012 12:01 PM, Matthew Cissell wrote:
>>     > Let me follow on your analogy but with a twist. Diseases do not
>>     create vaccines, people do in response to disease. In the same
>>     way criminals do not produce criminal law (except maybe in the IL
>>     state legislature and some other failing nation states), people
>>     produce laws to deal with criminal behaviour. So I agree that Z
>>     not only produces confusion and disbelief (there agreement ends),
>>     he produces a comfortable life for himself. "...must be
>>     profoundly shocking to the Intellectual Class", I don't know. I
>>     suspect I don't belong to that group. Read the bit in Lingua
>>     Franca and you will find something shocking, but mabye that has
>>     something to do with my work ethic.
>>     >
>>     > Go back to square one? The earth has been reset a couple of
>>     times but that is the type of hard boot that we don't want. Year
>>     one? That's been tried. The Kmer Rouge is somehow admirable for
>>     Zizek (proof the guy has his head too far up his own intellectual
>>     ass)? The kind of radical quasi-messianic break that Z wants is
>>     not for me, those things always go wrong. He should study more
>>     history. Rapid radical change brings bad consequences from the
>>     French Revolution to Iraq regime change. When will we learn? This
>>     big boat that we are all in takes a long time to change course.
>>     You can free slaves, and get rid of Jim Crow laws, and that's a
>>     good start, but it will not solve racism suddenly. Zizek wants a
>>     quick fix written in blood on the books of history (having the
>>     picture of Stalin above the bed is idiotic for being a childish
>>     shock factor or for sincere belief). the irony is that in some
>>     purge Z would probably get the Robespierre treatment.
>>     >
>>     >
>>     > It's not for me to tell people what to think, but when I see
>>     the emperor has no clothes I speak up.
>>     >
>>     > not so radical mc
>>     >
>>     > p.s. I love that the membership for the Zizek journal is
>>     through Facebook. What would Foucault say?
>>
>>     Good reply, Matthew.  Are you sure you're not a member of the
>>     Intellectual Class?
>>
>>     Still, I like it that, in my hyperbolic scenario, Z is the messenger
>>     (bearer) of ill tidings who gets killed.
>>
>>     Revolutionary justice.
>>
>>     P
>>
>>
>>     >
>>     >
>>     > ________________________________
>>     > From: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net
>>     <mailto:mackin.paul at verizon.net>>
>>     > To: pynchon-l at waste.org <mailto:pynchon-l at waste.org>
>>     > Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 5:24 PM
>>     > Subject: Re: review of Zizek ideas in NY review of books
>>     >
>>     >
>>     > On 6/22/2012 5:43 AM, Matthew Cissell wrote:
>>     >
>>     > I thought I had better look up the citation for what I wrote.
>>     If you want to read for yourself check Lingua Franca Oct 1998
>>     "Enjoy Your Zizek"
>>     >> I guess it wasn't so long ago.
>>     >>
>>     >>
>>     > Isn't Zizek a necessary and useful worker in the fields of Late
>>     >      Capitalism.  Just as criminals produce not only crime but also
>>     >      criminal law, Zizek produces not only confusion and
>>     disbelief  but .
>>     >      . . . well, something I probably don't really GET exactly,
>>     but do
>>     >      sense  must be profoundly shocking to the Intellectual
>>     Class. (the
>>     >      bourgeoisie is beyond shock) Little gems like Marx wasn't
>>     radical
>>     >      enough and Bush wasn't imperialist enough are only a
>>     start. Maybe
>>     >      it's time to go back to square one and start all over. Get
>>     a new
>>     >      paradigm, or something.
>>     >
>>     > Hopefully
>>     >
>>     > P
>>     >
>>     >
>>     >
>>     > mc otis
>>     >>
>>     >>
>>     >> ________________________________
>>     >> From: Prashant Kumar <siva.prashant.kumar at gmail.com
>>     <mailto:siva.prashant.kumar at gmail.com>>
>>     >> To: Matthew Cissell <macissell at yahoo.es
>>     <mailto:macissell at yahoo.es>>
>>     >> Cc: "pynchon-l at waste.org <mailto:pynchon-l at waste.org>"
>>     <pynchon-l at waste.org <mailto:pynchon-l at waste.org>>
>>     >> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 9:36 AM
>>     >> Subject: Re: review of Zizek ideas in NY review of books
>>     >>
>>     >>
>>     >> Wow and here I was about to defend him! I can never bring
>>     myself to trust people who treat students badly. Such a concerted
>>     attempt to quash discussion is shameful, and invites obvious
>>     questions.
>>     >>
>>     >>
>>     >> Prashant
>>     >>
>>     >> On Friday, 22 June 2012, Matthew Cissell wrote:
>>     >>
>>     >> Thanks for sending this along, Paul. The piece is more
>>     measured than the one that came up not long ago (by one Johann
>>     Hari) but it still hits Z hard, which he deserves.
>>     >>>
>>     >>> I read an article about 2 decades ago about Z. He was very
>>     open about being a scoundrel. It was the 90's and he started to
>>     be a big name (riding that cool theory wave) so he was in demand.
>>     This got him an invitation to teach at I forget which Uni in the
>>     US. He demanded a position for his wife as I recall - ok, fair
>>     enough. He would only teach one class (i don't think pay was
>>     mentioned, but is it necessary?) and they would provide him with
>>     accomodation. So far just a tough negotiator. Now the good part.
>>     >>>
>>     >>>
>>     >>> For the class he told his students that they didn't have to
>>     write anything, but if they did want him to evaluate their work,
>>     he would (imagine how this appeals to the slothful and
>>     intimidates the uncertain - genius). IN the case that someone
>>     wanted to talk to him they could only come in certain hours
>>     (understandable and standard) but they would have to come with
>>     their queries  and talking points written out (this avoids loose
>>     rambling students, so i can understand) and they would have to
>>     sign up on the list on his door. In the article he admitted to
>>     filling the list with false students names so that the others
>>     couldn't get in. I was shocked when I read that. It still sounds
>>     extremely low, even with  some years of teaching experience. I
>>     don't think I could bring myself to do that. It was then that I
>>     suspected that the man was running one on people who were ready
>>     to get taken in.
>>     >>> 200 yrs later we still discuss Hegel, 100 yrs later we still
>>     read and talk about Joyce. I think we all know that no one will
>>     be studying Dan Brown in 100 yrs. And Zizek? What will be his legacy?
>>     >>> That jazzy stuff sure sells to some, but long ago I began to
>>     think that the sparks and obfuscation were covering something up.
>>     >>>
>>     >>>
>>     >>> mc otis - still damn sick
>>     >>>
>>     >>>
>>     >>>
>>     >>> ________________________________
>>     >>> From: David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com
>>     <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com>>
>>     >>> To: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net
>>     <mailto:mackin.paul at verizon.net>>
>>     >>> Cc: "pynchon-l at waste.org <mailto:pynchon-l at waste.org>"
>>     <pynchon-l at waste.org <mailto:pynchon-l at waste.org>>
>>     >>> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 5:50 AM
>>     >>> Subject: Re: review of Zizek ideas in NY review of books
>>     >>>
>>     >>>
>>     >>> Don't know Mr Z, but don't think I want to.
>>     >>>
>>     >>> On Thursday, June 21, 2012, Paul Mackin
>>     >                              wrote:
>>     >>>
>>     http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2012/jul/12/violent-visions-slavoj-zizek/?page=2
>>     >>>> I hope this works without a subscription
>>     >                                but if not go to their web site
>>     nybooks.com <http://nybooks.com>
>>     >>>
>>     >>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> www.innergroovemusic.com <http://www.innergroovemusic.com>


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