Pynchons Problem

[Jamie Collinson]

Have you guys come across Joy Williams?

The Quick and the Dead is a masterpiece, and I think she has a lot in common with Pynchon, in terms of spirit at least.



On 14 Mar 2012, at 14:06, Keith Davis wrote:

> How about recommending something for my 9th grader, who's failing English after being forced to read Romeo and Juliet?
> 
> On Mar 14, 2012 10:00 AM, "Keith Davis" <kbob42 at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm in.
> 
> On Mar 14, 2012 9:57 AM, "Mark Kohut" <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Could we get an enthusiastic plurality--or enough plisters---to want to do a group read of THIS
>  great novel?
> 
> From: "kelber at mindspring.com" <kelber at mindspring.com>
> To: pynchon-l at waste.org 
> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 9:54 AM
> Subject: Re: Pynchons Problem
> 
> The Golden Notebook.
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Keith Davis 
> Sent: Mar 14, 2012 9:48 AM 
> To: kelber at mindspring.com 
> Cc: pynchon-l at waste.org 
> Subject: Re: Pynchons Problem 
> 
> Recommend one for me.
> On Mar 14, 2012 9:38 AM, <kelber at mindspring.com> wrote:
> Excellent post about the missing heroines. Bekah!  Women do seem better represented in the less-literary, more plot-driven genre of crime fiction (which I don't read, because I find it contrived - though I loved Nancy Drew as a kid).  And, of course, all those unspeakable romances, Harlequins, etc., which are written specifically for women.
> 
> What I like about Lessing's heroines is that they're intellectual and sexual.  Tempestuous they're not, nor even overly emotional, which may explain why they don't fit into the Bovary/O'Hara/Karenina mold. Honestly, though, they seem very real to me.  My mother was very much like them - she read avidly, and slept around in her younger days - and it was mother who insisted I read Lessing.
> 
> Laura
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Keith Davis 
> Sent: Mar 14, 2012 8:04 AM 
> To: Bekah 
> Cc: James Kyllo , pynchon -l , rich 
> Subject: Re: Pynchons Problem 
> 
> Great. Soon to read Possession. Good discussion.
> On Mar 14, 2012 1:46 AM, "Bekah" <bekah0176 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> First,  I had no inclination to "dis"   male writers about anything.   The post which said  Oedipa Maas could be Daisy Bucchanan's daughter started me thinking.  My head went,  "Yeah?  Well... which contemporary women characters are well-written then?"   I couldn't really think of any.  I can think of plenty of classics with strong and wonderfully well-written  women characters in them,  but contemporary?   Is a strong woman (as opposed to a sex object and/or a political statement)  out of fashion in books as much as in film?  Where are the Dorothea Brookes, the Isabel Archers,  the Emma Bovaries, the Scarlett O'Haras, the Anna Kareninas - etc?  Maybe I was missing them so I asked.  (Otoh,  maybe classic women characters aren't that different from what we have in contemporary literature - ? .)
> 
> Then, albeit a bit late,   I started wondering what I meant by the phrase "well-written" meant.  (gads)     "Liberated" ?  Not necessarily - lots of stereotyped "liberated" women around in detective fiction.   Did it mean "rounded" ala Forster?   Did it mean "poetically" written?  Did it mean contextually meaningful or issue-driven characters - ?   I don't know.  So by default,  any of the above (and more) can count.  (heh)  Mine?
> 
> Strong women / beautifully written:
> 
> Wallace Stegner's Susan Ward in Angle of Repose
> Toni Morrison's women are generally great -
> A.S. Byatt writes excellent female characters
> As I Lay Dying by Faulkner - all the women in that one
> Yashmine Harcourt in Against the Day by TRP
> 
> bekah
> 
> 
> On Mar 13, 2012, at 11:39 AM, Keith Davis wrote:
> 
> > Bekah, The paranoia set in because I thought you might be leading up to suggesting that male authors weren't writing good female characters.
> > I'd like to know what female characters you like, besides the ones you mentioned.
> >
> > On Mar 13, 2012 2:07 PM, "rich" <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Pat Barker's WW1 trilogy works on just about every level--war reporting, history, female emancipation, and of course as wonderful fiction
> >
> > rich
> >
> > On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 1:37 PM, James Kyllo <jkyllo at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Erica Tate (Alison Lurie - War Between the Tates) ?
> >
> > J
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 4:07 AM, Bekah <bekah0176 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> > Who,  in y'all's  opinion,  is a well-written female character of the post-WWII era  - use any author, any book.
> >
> > Bekah
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > http://www.last.fm/user/Auto_Da_Fe
> > http://www.pop.nu/en/show_collection.asp?user=2412
> > http://www.librarything.com/profile/Auto_Da_Fe
> > http://www.thedetails.co.uk/
> > http://www.songkick.com/users/Auto_Da_Fe
> > http://big-game.tumblr.com/
> >
> 
> 
> 

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