Back to AtD. Transcending negative sexual interpersonal emotions?

[Mark Kohut]

Maybe it's just me but I don't remember being convinced by the 
Reef/Yashmeen hookup, and I know with certainty that the Pyncher could 
have been more convincing if he'd wanted to be.

It's probably me.

P.

MK:
Once again, I don't think it is you. I'm a notorious fanboy of AtD yet,
except in some lyrical words from/about Yashmeen, I don't think
TRP brings off their relationship---EXCEPT as an idea......

Reef is a caricature, at least. 


----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net>
To: pynchon-l at waste.org
Cc: 
Sent: Monday, May 28, 2012 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: Back to AtD. Transcending negative sexual interpersonal emotions?

On 5/28/2012 10:52 AM, Mark Kohut wrote:
>
>
> From: Paul Mackin mackin.paul at verizon.net
>
> Are the promiscuous guys being INDICTED also?  :-)
> I think Yes in some way, if we believe TRP is presenting us with visions of
> love in these chapters of late 800s into 900s in AtD.......
>
> there is the happy threesome; there is Dally and Kit; there
> is Ewball and Stray; there is Frank and Wren...............
>
> "Variations on love/Love?"  the sections might be called?....with some textual
> implications, visions? about when it falls short including when it is simply 1)without attachment
> 2) doesn't last
> of which there are some attachments not meant to last.....Cyprian w Yashmeen, ultimately, even
> foreshadowing of his leaving in the text.
>
> Paul M. No adjectives modifying love:
> Yes, no qualification to the word 'love".I wrote 'real love" trying to indicate
> that many people think feeling jealous shows love.....whereas many depth psychologists
> argue that it can show feelings of possession, emotional and sexual possession feelings.

I'd go along with the idea that people may use the word 'love' to hang 
onto a relationship in danger of going under.  How can you leave me, I 
really love you. The pleader perhaps is feeling sexual jealousy, or 
maybe property jealousy. Is that what you mean?
>
> Yet, many--most?---psychologists in the West also think there is an exclusivity to
> romantic love.....don't they?

I would kind of doubt it.


>
> Is TRP attacking this belief with a Counter Narrative, a Counter-Ideal?

It wouldn't be a first :-)

Maybe it's just me but I don't remember being convinced by the 
Reef/Yashmeen hookup, and I know with certainty that the Pyncher could 
have been more convincing if he'd wanted to be.

It's probably me.

P




>
>
>
>
>
>> and here on 892,Dally says of her, "The woman gets jealous of oatmeal,
>> Hunter."
>> jealousy seen here as some psychologists write of it, a feeling of
>> insecurity over one's
>> sexual or emotional possessions, not of real love?
>
> In my humble opinion, one should never use the word 'real' to modify love.
>
> When a man tells a woman (or anyone) that he loves her, it should be unqualified.
>
> If he says I REALLY love you, she suspects he's holding something back--or that he is trying to coax her into something to which she might otherwise be unwilling to acquiesce.
>
> Or, if she asks, do you love me, he'd better not say OF COURSE I do. She will know the truth.
>
> P
>