The Feminization of American Culture: Ann Douglas: 9780374525583: Amazon.com: Books

[Phillip Greenlief]

not sure which thread this should go in - seems to be skirting both this one and 
the discussion that came out of "who has an english degree?" ... where people 
were discussing who gets read in universities these days.

i think it a bit strange that no one has mentioned william burroughs as a prime 
suspect for being a writer "worth studying". he's been a favorite for decades 
and his appeal doesn't seem to diminish ... for me, anyway. along with pynchon, 
i think he's really the only other really intriguing, compelling, and 
socially/politically relevant writer i can think of. his ideas about control are 
in tandem with some of the themes that pynchon posits, i think.

other writers were mentioned along the way in this discussion ... yeah, i would 
agree faulkner should be on this list. he dealt with a lot of 20th century 
problems in terms of narrative, structure and themes. i think LIGHT IN AUGUST 
was the book where he put it all together - was less concerned with stylistic 
advances and more concerned with spinning a profound study of personalities, 
race, and justice. dang. good book.

after the second world war, it's all about samuel beckett for me, but of course, 
he's not an american. 

no one mentioned joan didion, who i like more for her reportage than her fictive 
efforts. but she's a writer. i can say that for her.

no one mentioned gertrude stein, who, i admit, seemed to be very concerned with 
style as style as style as a way of communicating something in ways that had to 
do with style.

but post-war writers. i like j.g. ballard, but again - not american. 

is no one feeling flannery o'connor? 

i was seduced by toni  morrison and the seduction lasted about two years, then i 
went back to thinking hurston and jamaica kincaid had more to offer. i could be 
wrong.

the real geniuses in the post-war 20th century were musicians and composers and 
painters. i feel like the post-modern thing created an end-game that remains 
difficult to escape - how to escape the urge to be hip, to be ironic, to be 
someone like murakami, that is the emblem of all of that self-conscious crap.

ug, i've got to get back to work now.


 





________________________________
From: "malignd at aol.com" <malignd at aol.com>
To: pynchon-l at waste.org
Sent: Sun, September 30, 2012 3:15:25 PM
Subject: Re: The Feminization of American Culture: Ann Douglas: 9780374525583: 
Amazon.com: Books

It's Faulkner for the 20th century; for the first half, in a rout.  Hemingway 
wrote great stories (so did Faulkner) but only one great novel, and that was his 
first.  Try to read Across the River and Through the Trees without laughing. 
 Gatsby is a marvel, but it's one small book.  Kerouac?  Please ....



-----Original Message-----
From: Heikki Raudaskoski <hraudask at sun3.oulu.fi>
To: Markekohut <markekohut at yahoo.com>
Cc: jochen stremmel <jstremmel at gmail.com>; pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org>
Sent: Fri, Sep 28, 2012 6:45 am
Subject: Re: The Feminization of American Culture: Ann Douglas: 9780374525583: 
Amazon.com: Books


  May you live long, Mark!  As to me and the 1st half of the 20th century, I 
lost my heart in Yoknapatawpha County.   Heikki  On Fri, 28 Sep 2012, Markekohut 
wrote:  > I agree ......I might have  said that but Ann seems,consistent to me w 
her two  choices. In her judgme nts, she gives a lot of weight to a > sustained 
stylistic breakthrough as part of their greatness. In both cases,  they sorta 
asserted a new but subtle plain style against the prevailing > Overly refined 
style of the times. She sez. > > I don't think Kerouac is best then either if it 
isn't Pynchon and I'd vote for  him. > > > > Sent from my iPad > > On Sep 28, 
2012, at 5:50 AM, jochen stremmel <jstremmel at gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hemingway 
himself said F. Scott F. was the greatest and I tend to agree. > > (and of 
course I hope you're not dying anytime soon.) > > > > 2012/9/28 Markekohut 
<markekohut at yahoo.com>: > >> Speaking of Kerouac, as some have been---winking at 
you, Alice---this  woman, > >> Ann Douglas, whose good book here I recommend, 
was supposed to have her > >> sorta chronological sequel out > >> By  2007 ( or 
earlier) has still not published it but in it she will > >> supposedly argue 
that Jack K. Is the best American writer of the second  half > >> of the 20th 
Century as Ole Hem was of the first. > >> > >> It is a book I want to read so I 
hope she is writing it faster than I am > >> dying. > >> > >> Sent from my iPad 
> >> > >> Begin forwarded message: > >> > >> From: Mark Kohut 
<mark.kohut at gmail.com> > >> Date: September 27, 2012, 6:31:44 PM EDT > >> To: 
Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> > >> Subject: The Feminization of American 
Culture: Ann Douglas: 9780374525583: > >> Amazon.com: Books > >> > >> > >> 
http://www.amazon.com/The-Feminization-American-Culture-Douglas/dp/0374525587/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348785053&sr=8-1&keywords=ann+douglas
 > >> > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > 
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://waste.org/pipermail/pynchon-l/attachments/20121001/a43fa644/attachment.html>