Today's discussion question

[Ian Livingston]

Observations often come after one is alerted to a condition.


On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 12:43 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:

> Prejudice is often born out of bad experiences generalized from an
> incident, transformed into a rule.
>
>
> On Wednesday, August 14, 2013, Joseph Tracy wrote:
>
>> Prejudice means pre-judging. Ian indulged in postjudice based on direct
>> experience. I have witnessed similar shit with the whole born again
>> Christian thing where people keep their complex  neuroses, prejudices and
>> inclinations to mass violence despite the teachngs of Jesus.  Now everybody
>> chill and chant Om Mane Padme Hum ten times, say ten Hail Mary's and
>> compare results. What Menken fails to mention is that wisdom is not on tap
>> anywhere. So what? If there is wisdom,  and admit I think so,  it seems to
>> enter human consciousness and experience from many directions and be marked
>> by paradox.
>>
>> Back to Alice's question, I do think that the whole ultra chutzpa of
>> western science and of most religions has been tried and found wanting.
>> Less guns, less priests; more vegetables, more humility, more friendliness.
>>  Or are we betting on Ted Talks and free trade to save the world?
>>
>> Lenin said all political power comes from the barrel of a gun. That is a
>> truth I have never been able to reconcile myself with. It constitutes the
>> hard fact behind a lot of B.S.  Is Gravity's Rainbow at least partly
>> describing the emergence of corporate Leninism?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Aug 13, 2013, at 8:15 PM, David Morris wrote:
>>
>> > My point to Ian was about his prejudice re. Western Buddhist.
>> >
>> > On Tuesday, August 13, 2013, David Morris wrote:
>> > Again, your response ignores the context of my question to Ian, who
>> generally condemned Westerners who have adopted Buddhism and said he'd "run
>> afoul" of their I'll-fitting said adoption.  All of Ian's personal
>> experiences in that regard were on Western turf, where your answer to my
>> question is irrelevant at best.
>> >
>> > On Tuesday, August 13, 2013, Bekah wrote:
>> > By that logic no Christian could hate his neighbor because  "love" is a
>> fundamental goal of Christianity.   As far as I know,  all religions have
>> members whose behavior falls short of the goals of their creed.    That's
>> why these basics are goals and admonitions,  not penalized by expulsion
>> (therefore not a Christian) if the followers (members/believers)  fall
>> short.
>> >
>> > Bekah
>> >
>> >
>> > On Aug 13, 2013, at 4:47 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Please refer to my response to Malignd.
>> > >
>> > > On Tuesday, August 13, 2013, Bekah wrote:
>> > > Or on the Pakistani border or the Delhi slums where the Hindus clash
>> with the Muslims regularly.
>> > >
>> > > Sunday:
>> > >
>> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/10236064/Kashmir-Violence-escalates-between-Hindus-and-Muslims.html
>> > >
>> > > Bekah
>> > >
>> > > On Aug 13, 2013, at 2:06 PM, malignd at aol.com wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > You live as a Muslim in Burma.
>> > > > How does one run afoul of any Buddhist, of whatever stripe.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > From: David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>> > > > To: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
>> > > > Cc: alice wellintown <alicewellintown at gmail.com>; pynchon -l <
>> pynchon-l at waste.org>
>> > > > Sent: Mon, Aug 12, 2013 8:07 pm
>> > > > Subject: Re: Today's discussion question
>> > > >
>> > > > How does one run afoul of any Buddhist, of whatever stripe.  Did
>> someone criticize your words or behavior?  Did you cruely squash an
>> innocent bug in his presence?  Or is it that the Buddist ran afoul of your
>> prejudices?  From your harsh judgement of their aspirations, I would guess
>> the later.  "Equanimity" is a foundational goal of Buddhism.  Tolerance is
>> equanimity toward others.
>> > > >
>> > > > David Morris
>> > > >
>> > > > On Monday, August 12, 2013, Ian Livingston wrote:
>> > > > Well, I still wouldn't dare speak for P, but, parsing the statement
>> just a little, I will speak for myself, as someone undoubtedly influenced
>> by Pynchon rightly and wrongly by turns.
>> > > >
>> > > > I have had the great displeasure of running afoul Westerners in
>> Buddhist robes. These people who go bowing to the East in the certainty
>> that they will attain enlightenment through Eastern teachings take with
>> them all the shit they already believe, all the bunk they have learned in
>> school, and all their prejudices and try to shoehorn those into teachings
>> from sages who had no relation to the world we live in. They're like
>> Cinderella's step-sisters but that they go on believing that they are
>> wearing the glass slipper that never fit on their foot in the first place.
>> The whole delusion results in comically tormented psyches. It's a lot like
>> the people in the big Bible-thumping cults calling themselves Christians.
>> They are ruled by their own Shadows, living in darkness that wastes the
>> good any of them might accomplish in the world.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Mon, Aug 12, 2013 at 8:47 AM, alice wellintown <
>> alicewellintown at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > Mencken was, as is the average western philosopher, satirist,
>> pundit, blogger, spirit-hungry westerner...what have you, ignorant of the
>> tra
>
>
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