BE as P's attempt at Greek New Comedy

[Heikki Raudaskoski]

383 pages in, I have the growing feeling that a work by Pynchon finally
meets the totalizing "requirements" Jameson set for postmodernism
decades ago:

- the waning of affect
- blank and lukewarm pastiching
- the abolition of critical distance
- the all-pervasiveness of late capitalism with no space for opposition


Heikki

On Mon, 7 Oct 2013, Fiona Shnapple wrote:
> but P has Jameson out again here.
>
> On Monday, October 7, 2013, John Bailey wrote:
> > I think this is the first time P has used the term late capitalism. I
> > haven't heard it outside the classroom myself, which made it stand
> > out.
> > On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 12:07 PM, Fiona Shnapple <fionashnapple at gmail.com<javascript:;>>
> > wrote:
> > > Another question: did Pynchon use the term late-capitalism in IV or in
> > prior
> > > novels? Been thinking about what Robin said about the Left Content in
> > this
> > > novel. I happened to be quite fond of a lady who may win the Nobel for
> > > prosecuting a certain individual who is guilty of genocide with products
> > > made in the USA.  How's that for a female heroine fucking a fascist?
> > >
> > >  There is so much in the narrative drift of this book that point to such
> > > people, both the sinister and evil bastards who murder and waste life,
> > and
> > > those who fight them, protect the oppressed, resist the greeeed, the
> > > guzzling SUVs.
> > >
> > >
> > > So GTA, like so many Video Games is the topic of study in classes where
> > > Jameson is read.
> > >
> > > I don't think this is Game Over. That's not how I read it.
> > > On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 7:12 PM, John Bailey <sundayjb at gmail.com<javascript:;>>
> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> You know what these things mean FS.
> > >>
> > >> On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Fiona Shnapple <fionashnapple at gmail.com<javascript:;>
> > >
> > >> wrote:
> > >> > John, I'd like to respond, but you lost me, so, if you don't mind,
> > some
> > >> > basic questions:
> > >> >
> > >> > What is the old Greek comedy? What is the new Greek comedy?
> > >> > What is a Coover take?
> > >> > What is close third person?  I looked this last one up and was not
> > >> > convinced
> > >> > that the definition provided is what you have in mind.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Monday, October 7, 2013, John Bailey wrote:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> I'm increasingly wondering if the new novel isn't Pynchon's conscious
> > >> >> attempt to write a New Comedy, in contrast to the Old Comedy that
> > most
> > >> >> of his work can be aligned with. Or, if we're going to get more
> > >> >> detailed, with the Menippean Satire that some have convincingly
> > argued
> > >> >> is his forte. But I'm sticking with the Old/New divide of the Greeks
> > >> >> for the moment.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> It would perhaps explain why this one jars so much for so many. It's
> > >> >> sitcom, not systems analysis, and when it gives us types (Jewish
> > >> >> American, African American, Italian American) it doesn't do so in the
> > >> >> obviously ironic way his earlier works did. It doesn't give us the
> > >> >> linguistic miracles that offer a way out of the existential morass in
> > >> >> the manner we're used to P providing. It tries to offer characters
> > >> >> we're supposed to care for, which is antithetical to Old Comedy, even
> > >> >> if that mode is a more compassionate one on a structural level. BE
> > >> >> leaves us with mere people, individuals, not even a hint of the
> > >> >> preterite, which is interesting and a problem.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> A Coover take on 2001-02 would look more like what we could have
> > >> >> expected from Bleeding Edge.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Why, in both IV and BE, has Pynchon returned to close third person
> > >> >> narration (with at least one exception in BE that I've noticed?) It's
> > >> >> not What He Does. Not even in Vineland. He toyed with it in COL49 but
> > >> >> then declared it a minor work. Why go back there?
> > >> >> -
> > >> >> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l
> > >
> > >
> >
>
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Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l