Man in Hightower Netflix

Tue Dec 8 14:49:10 CST 2015

And I add this:

There is no surer way of evading the world than by Art; and no surer way of
uniting with it than by Art.

JOHANN WOLFGANG VON GOETHE, *The Maxims and Reflections of Goethe*

On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 3:34 PM, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com> wrote:

> SK > the only thing you can trust not to lie to you is the thing that
> never claims it isn't going to
>
> Clifford Geertz quotes Suzanne Langer: "The function of artistic illusion
> is not 'make-believe'... but the very opposite, disengagement from belief
> -- the contemplation of sensory qualities without their usual meanings of
> 'here's that chair,' 'that's my telephone'... etc. The knowledge that what
> is before us has no practical significance in the world is what enables us
> to give attention to its appearance as such."
>
> Geertz then goes on: "And like the common-sensical and the scientific (or
> the historical, the philosophical, and the autistic), this perspective,
> this 'way of seeing' is not the product of some mysterious Cartesian
>  chemistry, but is induced, mediated, and in fact created by means of
> symbols. It is the artist's skill which can produce those curious
> quasi-objects -- poems, dramas, sculptures, symphonies -- which,
> dissociating themselves from the solid world of common sense, take on the
> special sort of eloquence only sheer appearances can achieve."
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 2:14 PM, Steven Koteff <steviekoteff at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Yeah that is a good point. As someone who came of age in the Internet,
>> generally way more interested in the material (and in what I would've
>> called, Jesus, objectivity), in hard sciences, etc., I feel like my need to
>> experience the world via lets-just-call-it art (making and consuming)
>> increased as I saw more of (and more limits of) higher education, as I
>> understood more (and thus less) of the world, as my own life got harder and
>> more adult, so forth. The need for real truth (as distinct from anything
>> less) becomes more imperative and more high stakes, and the only thing you
>> can trust not to lie to you is the thing that never claims it isn't going
>> to. (There's more nuance and of course art lies, makes mistakes, but.)
>>
>> --FWIW friends I was really seduced by the first three seasons of
>> Breaking Bad but now I think it is essentially entertainment, and actually
>> secretly full of shit in a way that is so slick and close to the truth that
>> it attains some antichrist like qualities, if I may. Mad Men, on the other
>> hand...--
>>
>> But yeah I think Pynchon's work reigns supreme for people so-afflicted
>> (by the impossibility of making real sense of things beyond their ability
>> to grasp as you say Monte) at least in because not only does he speak so
>> much the language of the material/knowable but actually to the extent that
>> he has any identifiable system of belief it seems to be in
>> fallibility/chaos itself, and so is his art ABOUT that. I mean it's not a
>> novel insight I know.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 8, 2015, at 12:32 PM, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Perry: The dominant recent-history / current events memes of my 1950s and
>> early 1960s childhood were, as you'd expect, mostly Cold War, post-WWII US
>> triumphalism, and space. All became problematic as the 1960s went on,
>> creating the perfect setup for GR as "where it all began" when I was 23.
>> I've been unpacking them (and their successors) ever since, with Pynchon as
>> constant reassurance that burlesque and pastiche, dream and pastiche, make
>> more sense of it than the historians do.
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 12:39 PM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I don't doubt that a lot of the tradecraft in The Americans is inspired
>>> by former spy consultants but at the end of the day, like all historical
>>> dramas on the tube, it's pastiche. Doesn't mean it's a bad thing, it's a
>>> good thing, would be boring otherwise. George Smiley though makes the
>>> boring bits of espionage entertaining too and I like that. It's a cut above
>>> I agree but even he is pastiche.
>>>
>>> The meme thing Monte was talking about does make me wonder too. The
>>> television news of my childhood plays back like the opening credits
>>> montage. Big wall being hammered, princess being murdered, white Bronco
>>> speeding on a highway, separatists being killed and buildings blowing up. I
>>> was a junior in high school on 11 sep. I might not be remembering this very
>>> accurately but I recall the adults being much more traumatized than me and
>>> my peers that morning. Could just be that we were jaded teenagers, don't
>>> know for sure.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, December 8, 2015, rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I do like the Americans, too. and I agree some plots seem far-fetched
>>>> but when you hear about what went on/does go on in the intelligence
>>>> community in real life you do wonder sometimes. both leads are wonderful.
>>>> I would place George Smiley a cut above Bond and the rest. There's a
>>>> new bio out on LeCarre which I hope to start soon. Knowing a bit more about
>>>> places like Oxford and Cambridge really helped me understand alot about
>>>> British intelligence during the Cold War and  the cast of rogues and odd
>>>> ducks in LeCarre's books. The British series is of course peerless TV
>>>> unlike the recent movie which was utter crap.
>>>>
>>>> rich
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 10:38 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I can tell you that myself and my friends who were born in the 80s are
>>>>> well aware that The Americans is utter fiction. To me it's like Bond
>>>>> or George Smiley.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tuesday, December 8, 2015, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I wonder about the demographics for The Americans -- i.e., how many
>>>>>> 20- or 30-somethings are getting their "historical" view of the late Cold
>>>>>> War from it? I'm thinking of meme complexes such as the Wild West,  or
>>>>>> "Untouchables" crime in the Roaring Twenties (both quite limited and
>>>>>> transient in fact, but huge in cultural weight)... or for that matter "24"
>>>>>> and some other post-9/11 portrayals of the Global War on Something or Other.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think I was paying attention in the 1980s -- and I don't remember
>>>>>> 1% of The Americans level of espionage-related violence in and around
>>>>>> Washington, DC. I thought the whole point of superpower empire was that we
>>>>>> got to offshore the dirty work to Beirut, San Salvador, Kabul, Luanda,
>>>>>> etc...?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 10:10 AM, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 9:49 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ooh that looks good and it reminds me. I also love the TV show The
>>>>>>>> Americans. It's junk television and totally preposterous at times but
>>>>>>>> very very entertaining.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, December 8, 2015, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FppW5ml4vdw
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 9:10 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Behind Winston's back the voice from the telescreen was still
>>>>>>>>>> babbling away about pig-iron and the overfulfilment of the Ninth Three-Year
>>>>>>>>>> Plan. The telescreen received and transmitted simultaneously. Any sound
>>>>>>>>>> that Winston made, above the level of a very low whisper, would be picked
>>>>>>>>>> up by it, moreover, so long as he remained within the field of vision which
>>>>>>>>>> the metal plaque commanded, he could be seen as well as heard. There was of
>>>>>>>>>> course no way of knowing whether you were being watched at any given
>>>>>>>>>> moment. How often, or on what system, the Thought Police plugged in on any
>>>>>>>>>> individual wire was guesswork. It was even conceivable that they watched
>>>>>>>>>> everybody all the time. But at any rate they could plug in your wire
>>>>>>>>>> whenever they wanted to. You had to live -- did live, from habit that
>>>>>>>>>> became instinct -- in the assumption that every sound you made was
>>>>>>>>>> overheard, and, except in darkness, every movement scrutinized.
>>>>>>>>>> From *1984*
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/AuthorSpecAlphaList.asp?BkNum=143>,
>>>>>>>>>> by George Orwell
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/AuthorTotalAlphaList.asp?AuNum=61>
>>>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>>>> Published by Unknown in 1948
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 3:23 AM, Kai Frederik Lorentzen <
>>>>>>>>>> lorentzen at hotmail.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> THE TUBE
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Oh ... the ... Tube!
>>>>>>>>>>> It's poi-soning your brain!
>>>>>>>>>>> Oh yes....
>>>>>>>>>>> It's dri-ving you, insane!
>>>>>>>>>>> It's shoot-ing rays, at you,
>>>>>>>>>>> Over ev'ry-thing ya do,
>>>>>>>>>>> It sees you in your bedroom,
>>>>>>>>>>> And --- on th' toi-let too!
>>>>>>>>>>>             Yoo Hoo! The
>>>>>>>>>>> Tube....
>>>>>>>>>>> It knows your ev'ry thought,
>>>>>>>>>>> Hey, Boob, you thought you would-
>>>>>>>>>>> T'n get caught ---
>>>>>>>>>>> While you were sittin' there, starin' at "The
>>>>>>>>>>> Brady Bunch,"
>>>>>>>>>>> Big fat computer jus'
>>>>>>>>>>> Had you for lunch, now Th'
>>>>>>>>>>> Tube ---
>>>>>>>>>>> It's plugged right in, to you!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> (Vineland, pp.336-337)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm watching too much TV too, but the thread simply asked for
>>>>>>>>>>> this song. And isn't it amazing how Pynchon anticipated 'Smart-TV?'
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 08.12.2015 05:14, John Bailey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> A lot of people are loving Mr Robot (which I haven't seen). In the
>>>>>>>>>>> Black Mirror vein I believe.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> And oh yeah I did like Breaking bad but that was another one whose ending
>>>>>>>>>>> annoyed me. The penultimate episode worked better as an ending imo. They
>>>>>>>>>>> filmed the first season in Albuquerque during my final year at UNM and my
>>>>>>>>>>> compatriate played the bratty kid in the first episode so it was a mandatory
>>>>>>>>>>> watch. Show got harder for me to watch after moving out of Albuquerque. Was
>>>>>>>>>>> like becoming the outsider and seeing the city with a different perspective.
>>>>>>>>>>> Was a dirty place for me and it became clearer when recognizing the
>>>>>>>>>>> landmarks with a sufficient physical detachment from the place. I dunno, the
>>>>>>>>>>> show felt really icky. Great show though overall.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, December 7, 2015, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Breaking Bad was superb. I don't know Luther.  Is on Netflix or Amazon?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, December 7, 2015, Allan Balliett <allan.balliett at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Perry - What about Luther ? Or The Wire? You didn't like True Detective?
>>>>>>>>>>> Or the "recent" BBC Sherlock Holmes shows? I agree about Man in the High
>>>>>>>>>>> Castle. Too many of the binge tv series get sidetracked into unimportant
>>>>>>>>>>> character stories. (Good to see that Luther is getting a second coming as an
>>>>>>>>>>> American series. If its anything like the clip I saw on Late Night the other
>>>>>>>>>>> night, it's going to be a good un.)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -Allan in WV
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Dec 7, 2015 at 7:22 PM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> When it comes to teevee, sopranos and mad men spoiled me. Nothing else
>>>>>>>>>>> has really satisfied me.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, December 7, 2015, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I couldn't make it through the first episode.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, December 7, 2015, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Ten episodes in, and just tolerating it. Way too slowly paced and full
>>>>>>>>>>> of irrelevant personal drama interactions.  I haven't read the book, but I'm
>>>>>>>>>>> sure the plot is more important in the book than it is in this show.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> David Morris
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -
>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>
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