GR translation: almond fringes

[Mike Jing]

Corrected for grammar and duplicate words:

Finally, if you think my questions are beneath you, you are welcome to
ignore them. I am grateful for all your help in the past, but I
don't wish to be a burden or nuisance to anyone.

On Wed, Jun 29, 2016 at 2:10 AM, Mike Jing
<gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com> wrote:
> You mean Gottfried's aryan blue eyes.
>
> But anyway, that's mostly irrelevant to the translation. The reason I
> asked is that if "these almond fringes" are eyelashes, then the
> sentence would mean that the blue color of his eyes cannot be
> contained by his eyelashes, which doesn't quite make sense to me. I
> know his prose is poetic and all, but as always, it still has to make
> certain literal sense, at least on some level.
>
> Meanwhile, our disagreement is probably rather minor. After all,
> eyelashes do grow on the edge of eyelids, and that's exactly where the
> border of the eyes is. There is no reason why the "fringes" cannot
> include the edge of eyelids _and_ the eyelashes.
>
> Finally, if you think my questions are beneath you, you are welcome to
> ignore it. I am grateful for for all your help in the past, but I
> don't wish to be a burden or nuisance to anyone.
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 29, 2016 at 1:15 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> You really shouldn't be asking me such questions if you think you can
>> translate GR.  You should already have a sensitivity to his poetic prose.
>>
>> Enzian's aryan blue eyes are too beautiful to be contained within his eyes,
>> so they seek the source of their glory, the sky.  It means that his blue
>> aryan eyes are too beautiful to be contained in his face in Blicero's loving
>> observation.  They are like fountains of blue spilling out from his eyes
>> into the world.
>>
>> David Morris
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 28, 2016, Mike Jing <gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> OK, then what does it mean exactly that the blue of his eyes "is too
>>> much for these
>>> almond fringes"?
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jun 28, 2016 at 5:31 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > The only part of an eyelid that is an edge is the part lined with
>>> > lashes.
>>> > The rest is a covering. Lashes expressly resemble the primary meaning of
>>> > "fringe," which is a border composed of threads.  This whole thing is so
>>> > glaringly obvious that I can only conclude that you just want to make it
>>> > difficult.
>>> >
>>> > David Morris
>>> >
>>> > On Tue, Jun 28, 2016 at 4:14 PM, Mike Jing
>>> > <gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> From the OED:
>>> >>
>>> >> fringe, n.
>>> >>
>>> >> 1. a. An ornamental bordering, consisting of a narrow band to which
>>> >> are attached threads of silk, cotton, etc., either loose or formed
>>> >> into tassels, twists, etc.
>>> >>
>>> >> 2. a. Anything resembling this; a border or edging, esp. one that is
>>> >> broken or serrated.
>>> >>
>>> >> And read the sentence again:
>>> >>
>>> >> ". . . his eyelids already wrinkling in oddly young/old signatures,
>>> >> flourishes, the eyes a seldom-encountered blue that on certain days,
>>> >> in sync with the weather, is too much for these almond fringes and
>>> >> brims over, seeps, bleeds out to illuminate the boy’s entire face . .
>>> >> ."
>>> >>
>>> >> It seems to me that "these almond fringes" must be referring to "his
>>> >> eyelids", which form the border of the eyes, with the eyelashes as
>>> >> part of it.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> I could be totally wrong though, but in any case, there is no need to
>>> >> get snippy.
>>> >>
>>> >> Also, not sure if you sent this off-list in error, I'm keeping my
>>> >> reply private for now.
>>> >>
>>> >> On Tue, Jun 28, 2016 at 8:43 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >> > Do you know what fringe is?  How is it that you think eyelids are
>>> >> > fringe?
>>> >> > You two deserve each other.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fringe
>>> >> > Simple Definition of fringe
>>> >> >
>>> >> > : a border made of hanging threads used to decorate the edge of
>>> >> > something
>>> >> > (such as clothing, rugs, and curtains)
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > On Tue, Jun 28, 2016 at 12:19 AM, Mike Jing
>>> >> > <gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com>
>>> >> > wrote:
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> It seems to me the "almond fringes" are simply his eyelids, which
>>> >> >> could not contain the blue of his eyes so it "brims over".
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 3:08 PM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>>> >> >> wrote:
>>> >> >> > If he elided 'eyes'.....and the fringes refers to his whites...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Hey, I'm probably wrong just throwing it out as I do...but others,
>>> >> >> > you,
>>> >> >> > Mike,  will have to judge.
>>> >> >> > How do you 'prove' an elision? Why even suggest one? I ask myself.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Because almond as a color strikes me as.....Off ..from Pynchon,
>>> >> >> > but
>>> >> >> > we
>>> >> >> > know
>>> >> >> > how I project.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 2:58 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >> >> > wrote:
>>> >> >> >>
>>> >> >> >> OK, but how are eyes fringe?
>>> >> >> >>
>>> >> >> >> On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 1:55 PM, Mark Kohut
>>> >> >> >> <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>>> >> >> >> wrote:
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>> http://www.classic-colors.com/ENG/PRODUCTCOLOR/COLOR_Almond
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>> almond eyes shape
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>> As we've learned, Pynchon sometimes elides...and he often, often
>>> >> >> >>> packs
>>> >> >> >>> multiple meanings when he can.
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>> On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 2:45 PM, David Morris
>>> >> >> >>> <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >> >> >>> wrote:
>>> >> >> >>>>
>>> >> >> >>>> The text doesn't say "almond eyes."  It says "almond fringes,"
>>> >> >> >>>> which
>>> >> >> >>>> means blond eyelashes in the context of of his "imponderable
>>> >> >> >>>> net
>>> >> >> >>>> of
>>> >> >> >>>> gold"
>>> >> >> >>>> leg hair and his "eyes a seldom-encountered blue."
>>> >> >> >>>>
>>> >> >> >>>> David Morris
>>> >> >> >>>>
>>> >> >> >>>> On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Mark Kohut
>>> >> >> >>>> <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>>> >> >> >>>> wrote:
>>> >> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>> Almond eyes are narrow and elongated in shape. ... This shape
>>> >> >> >>>>> is
>>> >> >> >>>>> usually quite large and round (similar to prominent eyes).
>>> >> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>> On Wed, Jun 15, 2016 at 3:12 AM, Mike Jing
>>> >> >> >>>>> <gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >> >> >>>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>>> V102.18-26   Gottfried, in the cage, watches her slip her
>>> >> >> >>>>>> bonds
>>> >> >> >>>>>> and
>>> >> >> >>>>>> go. Fair and slender, the hair on his legs only visible in
>>> >> >> >>>>>> sunlight
>>> >> >> >>>>>> and then as a fine, imponderable net of gold, his eyelids
>>> >> >> >>>>>> already
>>> >> >> >>>>>> wrinkling in oddly young/old signatures, flourishes, the eyes
>>> >> >> >>>>>> a
>>> >> >> >>>>>> seldom-encountered blue that on certain days, in sync with
>>> >> >> >>>>>> the
>>> >> >> >>>>>> weather, is too much for these almond fringes and brims over,
>>> >> >> >>>>>> seeps,
>>> >> >> >>>>>> bleeds out to illuminate the boy’s entire face, virgin-blue,
>>> >> >> >>>>>> drowned-man blue, blue drawn so insatiably into the chalky
>>> >> >> >>>>>> walls
>>> >> >> >>>>>> of
>>> >> >> >>>>>> Mediterranean streets we quietly cycled through in noontimes
>>> >> >> >>>>>> of
>>> >> >> >>>>>> the
>>> >> >> >>>>>> old peace. . . .
>>> >> >> >>>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>>> Does the "almond" in "almond fringes" refer to shape? Or
>>> >> >> >>>>>> something
>>> >> >> >>>>>> else?
>>> >> >> >>>>>> -
>>> >> >> >>>>>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>>> >> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >> >>>>
>>> >> >> >>>
>>> >> >> >>
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >
>>> >
-
Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l