"Fun Was Actually Becoming Quite Subversive" (Molly Hite)

Thu Mar 31 11:01:41 CDT 2016

The exact quote originated from the testimony of Abbie Hoffman and reads
“fun was very important… it was a direct rebuttal of the kind of ethics and
morals that were being put forth in the country to keep people working in a
rate race.”

The exact quote, of course, has "rat race." RIP A. Hoffman.

2016-03-31 17:32 GMT+02:00 Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>:

> My observations are not meant to be definitive, and I believe there  is
> along with some dark undertones, a  refreshing subversive quality to the
> humor of these soldiers, spies etc. What I see again and again is an
> undermining of our inherited ways of looking at WW2 and thus of many other
> issues. Our desire to be heroes is being questioned here. Human fantasies
> and dreams have tremendous reality to humans, affecting us on practical and
> psychological levels. Pynchon treats this dreamier material with what seems
> to me equal weight to other parts of history/experience. After all, a book
> is a dream.
> Whether Slothrop’s map is about sexual fantasies or real events doesn’t
> matter in the context of the story. They have a mysteriously predictive
> quality as do so many dreams and actual affairs. It seems to me that P
> wants to leave that prophetic intrusion into human affairs intact even when
> it may have scientific or psychological explanations.  Even if all meaning
> is paranoid delusion, which is not so far from certain Bhuddist thinking,
> and we have a sense of another way of being, we will be asked to
> approximate what remains in our experience. The language that follows, to
> the degree that language is the means of communication, tends to the
> allusive, the poetic. The Tao that can be put into words is not the Tao.
>
> > On Mar 31, 2016, at 8:11 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > So,  sorry Joseph for too shallow a post.
> >
> > And, John, thinking about your observations combined with my current
> preoccupation with
> > the poetic 'compression' of allusions, themes and meanings in GR----I
> mean, GR is as densely
> > poetic as The Wasteland and, what? fifty times longer?---the levels of
> 'reality' vs 'not' and levels
> > of fantasy vs 'the real' can now be compared to P opening out all such
> levels in
> > AtD, the narrative about Chums within stories interacting with a 'real'
> world and later merging
> > --in the tales-- with other imagined beings who then become 'real'
> within the history of the book.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 7:44 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > I would agree in general since P makes fun---satirizes to use a 'high'
> term
> > for low fun--but right HERE it seems to me he has made a point of the
> contrast
> >
> > so that we can see another level of real life fantasies vs dreams and
> fantasies.
> >
> > But I see your point and glad it is made.
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 7:36 AM, John Bailey <sundayjb at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I don't know that there is an opposing of "dreams and fantasies"
> > versus reality within the diegesis of GR. The language of the banana
> > sequence, the mad macro and micro of molecules and bombs and this dude
> > who apparently can be yoked with the fantasies of others... I think
> > the reader is supposed to be knotted into this however they're able to
> > be. I'd argue the sequence isn't about whaling sanctions or double
> > entry accounting but JT's reading isn't too on the nose.
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 10:08 PM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > Joseph T writes:
> > > Fun? This is fun of very boyish fantasy materials. Wars start with
> these
> > > fantasies of conquest, potency, control through killing.
> > >
> > > There is a nice range of ambiguity in possible 'readings' of this
> scene as
> > > we have been exploring but there are 'readings' which are projective
> and
> > > absolutely against the ranges within the text.
> > >
> > > Your second sentence is one of them.....esp the line "control thru
> killing'
> > > which comes from WHERE here?   P explores
> > > the fantasies that feed and create wars but Pirate and crew HERE are
> NOT
> > > enacting any fantasy---P purposely contrasts Pirate
> > > waking up and creating this breakfast for all with the dream and
> fantasies.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 3:24 AM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> The gas released from Bananas is  known to make other fruits ripen.
> The
> > >> chemistry of gases is a major force in German technology of the time,
> > >> chemicals liquid and gaseous, released from coal, fossil fuels long
> in the
> > >> ripening.  The ( C)Osmos nose is big and smells something big,
> something
> > >> ripening. The bananas are growing up from the black soil of recycled
> dead
> > >> organic matter.
> > >>
> > >> Fun? This is fun of very boyish fantasy materials. Wars start with
> these
> > >> fantasies of conquest, potency, control through killing. War releases
> a
> > >> powerful ripening, some to spoilage and rot, some to death and
> recycling,
> > >> some to seek a freedom that can’t be taken away in a moment. People
> make
> > >> jokes to cope with situations they can’t control, madness they want to
> > >> challenge. Pirate sings goofball guy humor as do the Yanks on the
> street.
> > >> Lookout primates, other primates and other bananas are falling from
> above.
> > >> We send them up and by God they come right down.
> > >>
> > >> It is interesting in some weird way that I would call both Cruz and
> Trump
> > >> adenoidal The sound of their voice like an echo chamber of egotism .
> Is
> > >> Adenoia anything like Paranoia?
> > >>
> > >> Can’t keep up with the list as i’d like to right now, too many
> demands on
> > >> my time. But enjoying a quick read-through tonight.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> > On Mar 28, 2016, at 1:27 PM, kelber at mindspring.com wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > I don't see much fun in the description of the Banana breakfast -
> the
> > >> > tone is more of a surreal, desperate attempt to forget what's
> happening
> > >> > outside. It's not Pynchon who's saying fuck off, but "the high
> intricacy of
> > >> > the weaving of its [the musaceous odor] molecules.
> > >> >
> > >> > Earlier, on the roof: "Pirate has become famous for his Banana
> > >> > Breakfasts … the politics of bacteria, the soils stringing of rings
> and
> > >> > chains in nets only God can tell the meshes of, having seen the
> fruit thrive
> > >> > to lengths of a foot and a half, yes, amazing but true." These are
> unnatural
> > >> > bananas, grown in the shadow of the power station and the gasworks.
> > >> >
> > >> > Why the references to molecules here? They're the first of many
> > >> > references to organic (i.e. unnatural) chemistry. Similarly, I
> don't think
> > >> > the Adenoid appears as a random, comic incident. Pynchon isn't
> going to
> > >> > write about the holocaust directly, but it hovers in the
> background. At
> > >> > least that's how I read it.
> > >> >
> > >> > LK
> > >> >
> > >> > -----Original Message-----
> > >> > From: Monte Davis
> > >> > Sent: Mar 28, 2016 11:11 AM
> > >> > To: Mark Kohut
> > >> > Cc: Kai Frederik Lorentzen , pynchon -l , kelber
> > >> > Subject: Re: "Fun Was Actually Becoming Quite Subversive" (Molly
> Hite)
> > >> >
> > >> > "...a wonderful breakfast... the scent alone is enough to ward of[f]
> > >> > death, Pynchon famously says “Fuck Death.” So by indulging in this
> pleasure,
> > >> > they are able to escape death, they are able to escape the
> trajectory of
> > >> > human nature even if just for a morning.. maybe by not denying these
> > >> > pleasures we might be able to get out of the arc of human nature..."
> > >> >
> > >> > This is more or less how I read the banana breakfast, too: Bakhtin's
> > >> > carnival, Brueghel's land of Cockaigne, a celebration of excess
> mocking
> > >> > wartime austerity. Yes, it's anomalous in the novel's larger world:
> an
> > >> > island or oasis or refuge, just as the rooftop bananery is an
> artificial
> > >> > enclosure against December chill, just as its bananas are luxuries
> available
> > >> > only to these officers with connections. Still, "a spell, against
> falling
> > >> > objects" seems to me as good as it gets in that world.
> > >> >
> > >> > Which is why I respectfully disagree with part of Laura's discussion
> > >> > last week:
> > >> >
> > >> > LK> The musaceous odor. Anyone who's ever taken organic chemistry
> (did
> > >> > Pynchon? Anyone know?) has probably synthesized banana ester in the
> lab.
> > >> > it's a standard lab exercise, and it's easy to know if you've got
> it right,
> > >> > by that musaceous odor ... So even when Pynchon is talking about
> Nature (in
> > >> > this case, unnaturally growing bananas), he's reminding us how easy
> it is
> > >> > for science to mimic it, or to tear apart and exploit the delicate
> > >> > molecules.
> > >> >
> > >> > There are certainly many places in GR where industrial organic (and
> > >> > inorganic) chemical technology has an unmistakably evil, negative,
> > >> > anti-human or even "anti-life" context and emotional affect. BUT
> NOT, I
> > >> > mildly demur, HERE!
> > >> >
> > >> > Pynchon gives us "peculiar alkaloids" in the bananery's
> long-composted
> > >> > soil... "the politics of bacteria, the soil’s stringing of rings
> and chains
> > >> > in nets only God can tell the meshes of"... "musaceous odor..."
> > >> > "taking over not so much through any brute pungency or volume as by
> the
> > >> > high intricacy to the weaving of its molecules"... "genetic
> chains...
> > >> > labyrinthine enough to preserve some human face down ten or twenty
> > >> > generations"
> > >> >
> > >> > But does he, HERE, say or imply anything about artificial synthesis
> (as
> > >> > contrasted with life's proliferating variety)? Does he say anything
> about a
> > >> > "mimicked" smell as distinct from the real smell of real yummy
> 'nanas? Are
> > >> > there any "delicate" molecules being "torn apart" and "exploited"
> here --
> > >> > other than as life has routinely, "by its nature" done so 24/7 for
> a few
> > >> > billion years before IG Farben came along? No.
> > >> >
> > >> > I'm fine with Laura writing about her associations, which I believe
> were
> > >> > brought on by Pynchon's uses (above) of chemical and biological
> vocabulary
> > >> > and concepts. In fact, I share them: I've made isoamyl acetate and
> isopentyl
> > >> > acetate, too. But that's quite different from "Pynchon is reminding
> us" of
> > >> > "science" doing any such thing. In fact, I read those phrases above
> as
> > >> > integral to the unmistakably positive, celebratory "flavor" of the
> banana
> > >> > breakfast -- not as a coded warning that exploitive synthetic
> technology is
> > >> > lurking beneath. The weaving and unweaving of molecules *is*,
> explicitly, "a
> > >> > charm, against falling objects."
> > >> >
> > >> > Here's a reader I respect and admire, and a stock response that runs
> > >> > through fifty years of Pynchonology: "Everyone knows that Pynchon
> mistrusts
> > >> > and fears and warns us about science and technology, so wherever
> their
> > >> > vocabulary and concepts crop up, he's on the attack."
> > >> >
> > >> > This matters to me, as I wrote at length in the exchanges here in
> June
> > >> > of 2013:
> https://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l&month=1306&msg=174066 ,
> > >> > etc etc etc...
> > >> >
> > >> > It leads, again and again, to systematic ignoring and misreading of
> > >> > positive, mixed and ambivalent  contexts and associations for P's
> uses of
> > >> > scientific and technical vocabulary, concepts, and perspectives.
> Fair
> > >> > warning: I'll be coming back to this throughout the BtZ42, and
> throughout GR
> > >> > if we continue.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Mon, Mar 28, 2016 at 5:24 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> > >> > wrote:
> > >> > "having evidently the time, in his travels among places of death, to
> > >> > devote to girl-chasing"---p.19 Miller edition
> > >> >
> > >> > I believe Ms. Hite is the one who also said, when encountering the
> claim
> > >> > that the Whole Sick Crew were 'hysterical' caricatures
> > >> > said: "I knew these people' IRL.
> > >> >
> > >> > On Mon, Mar 28, 2016 at 4:13 AM, Kai Frederik Lorentzen
> > >> > <lorentzen at hotmail.de> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > Molly Hite’s critical work with Pynchon published in 2004 has the
> > >> > > title “Fun Actually Was Becoming Quite Subversive.” It is an
> interesting
> > >> > > title, because it originated somewhere completely different than
> Gravity’s
> > >> > > Rainbow, in fact it came from the 1969 trial of the Chicago
> Seven, a group
> > >> > > of young men from antiwar and revolutionary groups accused of
> disrupting the
> > >> > > 1968 Democratic Convention. This was considered a very important
> trial in
> > >> > > the counterculture movement, something Pynchon famously embraced
> in his
> > >> > > works. The exact quote originated from the testimony of Abbie
> Hoffman and
> > >> > > reads “fun was very important… it was a direct rebuttal of the
> kind of
> > >> > > ethics and morals that were being put forth in the country to
> keep people
> > >> > > working in a rate race.” Hite uses this to introduce her
> interpretation of
> > >> > > Pynchon. She argues that “the idea of fun could subvert an
> oppressive
> > >> > > capitalist structure is central to this novel of excess.”
> > >> >             Molly Hite uses Herbert Marcuse’s 1955 culture synthesis
> > >> > Eros and Civilization: A Philosophical Inquiry into Freud to help
> frame her
> > >> > argument, and plainly states that this work must have influenced
> Pynchon.
> > >> > Marcuse claims that the period of time, which this book was written
> in, was
> > >> > a period of great productivity and excess, and with the
> technological
> > >> > advances, it became economically feasible to have a “leisure
> culture.”
> > >> > However with this culture of leisure comes a raising of standards
> and
> > >> > consequently a “surplus-repression.” This is repression is the
> repression of
> > >> > Freudian pleasures, conceding or flat out rejecting the
> gratification of
> > >> > many desires which Freud saw as necessary for a society to organize
> and
> > >> > survive. Marcuse argues that by denying these pleasures principles
> that
> > >> > “advanced civilizations are in danger from a second group of
> instinctive
> > >> > impulses striving for death.” This, Hite states, is where we get the
> > >> > dramatization of the destruction from the rocket, as it becomes
> global. She
> > >> > argues “The V-2 Rocket rises under human guidance..” and this is
> where we
> > >> > understand the “death drive.” This is the natural tendency of
> society, to
> > >> > progress to a certain point, and then fall into the death drive;
> the arc of
> > >> > human civilization not unlike the arc of the bomb.
> > >> >
> > >> >             Hite states that Pynchon understood Marcuse’s
> possibility of
> > >> > escape from postindustrial destruction, and encoded it in his book,
> however
> > >> > slight this chance might be. By not becoming individuals we are
> doomed to,
> > >> > as individuality in Gravity’s Rainbowis synonymous with disrupting
> the
> > >> > productivity and subsequent regression of human nature. This is
> where the
> > >> > overt sexual tones of the book come from, especially the more
> risqué ones.
> > >> > These sexual acts are done not in hopes of productivity, or
> reproducing, but
> > >> > simply out of pleasure. By not denying these pleasures and becoming
> > >> > individual of the society, we can escape the trajectory of
> destruction. Hite
> > >> > does acknowledge that these chances are incredibly small, that
> betrayal and
> > >> > self-defeating tendencies are built into the system, that “every
> revolution
> > >> > has been a betrayed revolution.” So for Hite’s interpretation,
> humanity is
> > >> > at stake, the trajectory is annihilation, and Pynchon offers a way
> to escape
> > >> > that trajectory.
> > >> >
> > >> >             I would like to agree with Hite in her thinking. In the
> very
> > >> > beginning of the novel, we are introduced with a very dark image of
> the
> > >> > concentration camp, with people being ushered into a bleak hotel.
> At that
> > >> > hotel, they wait quietly for the bomb to drop without any hope
> left. Right
> > >> > after we get that dark image, we are given one of the most colorful
> scenes
> > >> > in the novel, the banana breakfast. After a night of indulging in
> alcohol to
> > >> > excess, Pirate wakes up and picks bananas, something that was
> rationed
> > >> > during the time period. He then begins to cook a wonderful breakfast
> > >> > consisting of banana everything, and the scent alone is enough to
> ward of
> > >> > death, Pynchon famously says “Fuck Death.” So by indulging in this
> pleasure,
> > >> > they are able to escape death, they are able to escape the
> trajectory of
> > >> > human nature even just for a morning. I believe scenes like this
> are a clear
> > >> > road map that Pynchon gives us, that maybe by not denying these
> pleasures we
> > >> > might be able to get out of the arc of human nature, or in
> Pynchon’s work,
> > >> > the literal bomb. The chances are slim however, these people are
> protected
> > >> > only as long as the scent of the banana breakfast wafts over them,
> but the
> > >> > chance does exist.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Hite, Molly, “‘Fun Was Actually Becoming Quite Subversive’: Herbert
> > >> > Marcuse, the Yippies, and the Value System of Gravity’s Rainbow,”
> > >> > Contemporary Literature 51.4 (Winter 2010): 677-702. <
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> https://englit0500.wordpress.com/2014/04/01/fun-actually-was-actually-becoming-subversive/
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > - Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l
> > >>
> > >> -
> > >> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
> -
> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>
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