Re: AtD translation: “That mean the deal’s off?”

[Mike Jing]

Thanks, David and Mark.


On Sun, Jan 9, 2022 at 6:29 AM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:

> I agree with David wholly here, there is no real deal. But I want to add a
> suggestive overlay of interpretation,
> under a possible extended Reading, possible psychological resonances.
>
> Frank overtly articulates what is a 'thing', the Male Gaze. (the
> aforementioned, overrated, J. Franzen actually
> uses this phrase capped in one recent *novel*, not the latest). Known to
> just about all women long before
> Jean Paul Sartre got his fame and words to reify it in the public
> discourse. (Ask any class of women it they know
> what the male gaze is--even before defining-- and watch all the heads nod.
> They know by the phrase alone.
> [Too personal: I won't forget the woman who told me "Your look penetrated
> me". And I wasn't canceled---or even banished]
>
> Notice higher on the page: "Frank was gazing at her; the face men got in
> dance halls sometimes, almost a smile."
>
> "The existentialist philosopher Jean-Paul Sartre
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Paul_Sartre> introduced the concept of
>  *le regard*, the gaze <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaze>, in *Being
> and Nothingness <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Being_and_Nothingness>* (1943)
> wherein the act of gazing at another human being creates a subjective
> difference in social power <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_power>,
> which is felt by the gazer and by the gazed upon person; “by their presence
> — most forcibly, by looking into your eyes — other people compel you to
> realize that you are an object for them.”[13
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male_gaze#cite_note-Stack-13>""
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male_gaze#:~:text=The%20male%20gaze%20is%20a%20manifestation%20of%20unequal,inequality%20in%20service%20to%20a%20patriarchal%20sexual%20order
> .
>
> Stray quips that she got the look because she 'went fishin'" [for
> compliments; for the Gaze?] in that "li'l doily joint."
>
> "if she hadn't known better she might have taken his gaze for
> resentful"......Why resentful?...Because he felt entitled because of his
> desire? Resentful
> that he had not "had' her, did not? Is that what Frank was hoping was the
> deal, his overt desire for her because of her beauty would make her love
> being
> so desired and let him? ...It happens to some men. .....yet, she knew
> better about Frank, his gaze did not contain that "ownership" entitlement.
>
> And the puzzling (to me) last line: "Hey. I love him, too".......?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 8:01 AM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> There probably isn’t any “deal,” meaning some kind of bargain or contract
>> between him and Stray.  He’s sort of joking, but sort of not joking,
>> hoping
>> she feels something deeper than any explicit words that they have
>> exchanged.
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 4:27 AM Mike Jing <gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > P651.10-17   “Oh, make up another one, I saw you when you were twenty.”
>> If
>> > she hadn’t known better she might have taken his gaze for resentful.
>> > Finally, “Stray, the first time I saw you, I knew I’d never see anybody
>> > that beautiful again, and I never did, until you walked in that li’l
>> doily
>> > joint the other day.”
>> >        “What I get for fishin.”
>> >        “That mean the deal’s off?”
>> >        “Frank—”
>> >        “Hey. I love him too.”
>> >
>> > What deal is Frank talking about here?
>> > --
>> > Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>> >
>> --
>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>>
>