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[Heikki Raudaskoski]

Good post. However, accepted art in Nazi Germany was Rossinian indeed,while
those great Beethovenian offspring Schoenberg, Berg and Webern - all referred
to in GR - were despised by Nazis, and not only because Schoenberg was Jewish.
With Schoenberg having emigrated to the States in 1933 and Berg having died in
1935, Webern was the only one alive in Europe when the Nazis took over Austria
in 1938; they regarded him as "Cultural Bolshevist".

"Venice and Vienna"; I wouldn't be surprised if the abovementioned triumvirate
of the "New Viennese School" that started in 1904 were touched upon in ATD, let
alone their mentor Mahler, who (besides Thomas Mann himself) was a model for the
Aschenbach character in "Death in Venice", as we know.


Heikki


On Fri, 18 Aug 2006 robinlandseadel at comcast.net wrote:

> The Beethoven contra Rossini thread in GR is priceless stuff and
> there's all sorts of possible paired antagonists by the time 1900 rolls
> around. The first one to slap me across the forehead is Offenbach
> (1819-80) contra Wagner (1813-83). Pretty much putting the stark
> differences that fire up the Beethoven/Rossini pairing in bold relief.
> This pair is aimed more specifically in the general direction of musical
> Nazism (which was the whole point of the Gustav/Saure Bummer dialog:
> This is music of great historical and evolutionary importance, which is
> the most important thing”/”This music makes me feel good, which is the
> most important thing” and I’m with the gnarly old doper myself even
> though Beethoven is one of my favorite composers.) The whole Offenbach
> gestalt is much like Rossini’s, but sillier. Wagner, among other things,
> was Hitler’s favorite composer. Wagner’s musical language can be (and in
> Gustav’s world, is) thought of as the natural extension of Beethoven’s
> language.
>
> Move ahead to the central years of ATD and we reach a Pynchonian
> match-up I’d adore: Mahler/Strauss, which happens to be a double edged
> sword. Mahler was a colossus and arguably the greatest of Beethoven’s
> musical disciples. There are two Strauss’s, both decadent. Johann Jr,
> (and the rest of his family) pumped out dance tunes at a furious clip.
> Johnann Jr’s gifts are much like Benny Andersson’s, the ability to make
> a tune with all the gloss and romance of a Nora Roberts novel and yet still
> be a musical genius all the same. There’s something inescapable about
> those melodies. (I hear a Pynchon song coming on . . .). And then
> there's the other Strauss, emerging from the past with all the
> atmospherics of a David Lynch movie---here’s Richard Strauss, probably best  
> known for the overused first minute of “Also Sprach Zarathrustra”, managed to
> make out the greatest Drag-King spectacle of all time in “Der Rosenkavalier”,
> got down and decadent in “Salome” and “Electra”, did a bit of piecework
> for the Nazis and eventually exonerated himself with “Four Last Songs”. Lived
> a long time. Was one of the first musicians to be recorded
> on magnetic tape. Really could find a little space in Gravity’s Rainbow, if ya
> catch my drift.
>
> And, again on the Offenbach/Rossini side of the axis is /are “Gilbert &      
> Sullivan” (Sullivan, the composer, 1842-1900), arguably the silliest of the  
> great composers. Clearly a long time inspiration to our beloved author.
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "David Kipen" <kipend at gmail.com>
> As I read everything about 1893-1920 or so that I can get my hands on, I'm   
> wondering what to listen to while I read. In other words, how would the      
> musically inclined among you complete the following by no means exhaustive   
> series?
>
>  V. (Stravinsky's Rite of Spring, Eric Dolphy, Clifford Brown)
> The Crying of Lot 49 (Bartok's Concerto for Orchestra)
> Gravity's Rainbow (Charlie Parker's Cherokee; assorted Rossini, Beethoven,   
> Webern)
> Slow Learner (John Barry's James Bond scores?)
> Vineland (Bach's *Sleeper's Awake *cantata)
> Mason & Dixon (assorted Quantz)
> Against the Day (??????????)
>
> All ears,
> David
>
>