ATD SPOILER p 262-269

[pynchonoid]

SPOILER













Actually, no, I don't get that feeling about Pynchon
relative to this material, not at all, and certainly
didn't mean to suggest anything like that, not at all.
I don't see him as a stern patriarchal moralizing
judge when it comes to sex, and I wouldn't expect him
to parrot the voices  of conventional morality that
might seek such an interpretation. Since I haven't
finished the novel, I don't know what ATD has in store
for Lake.    I expect that close reading of this
scene, in its various contexts within ATD, and
relative to similar scenes (as Robin suggests)
Pynchon's other novels, will reveal a lot going on
beneath the surface.  

Pynchon is dealing with sensitive material here, and
were it not for the way he has specifically addressed
issues of how he dealt with women in his early novels
(In the Slow Learner intro), it might be tempting to
assume  patriarchal values on the author's part might
be coming into play here, with a scene intended to be
read as you suggest.  But having made it an issue that
addressed in such a public way, I'm expecting close
reading to uncover references and allusions that will
provide other ways of looking at these passages with
Lake, Deuce, and Sloat.



--- gp <wescac at gmail.com> wrote:

> SPOILER
>
> 
> Frankly - don't you get the feeling that Pynchon
> meant Lake "deserved"
> it in a way for shacking up with the guy who killed
> her dad?  She was
> totally debased and suggesting that the two guys do
> each other is
> really nothing compared to what they do to her. 
> Like a sort of
> obscene retribution that perhaps ghost-Webb helped
> conspire?
> 
> On 12/4/06, pynchonoid <pynchonoid at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > --- robinlandseadel at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >  -------------- Original message
> > > ----------------------
> > > From: pynchonoid <pynchonoid at yahoo.com>
> > > > SPOILER
> > > > scroll down
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> > > > Sheer speculation (perhaps dangerous in this
> > > crowd)
> > > > but I wonder if Pynchon's niece had any
> influence
> > > on
> > > > these passages with Lake, Deuce, Sloat.
> > > >
> > > > Reminds me of Frenesi and Brock in Vineland,
> but
> > > > rougher.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > What I wonder, in revolving over the four
> corners in
> > > four corners, is  this sequence related, in any
> way
> > > to the occult overtones of the Brigidier Pudding
> sex
> > > scene, and Geli Tripping's A. E. Waite
> spell/orgasm
> > > in GR? Some how, the summonimg of directions
> > > comes to mind. There is an even freakier scene
> > > later on in the book with similar resonances.
> >
> >
> > I don't doubt that Pynchon has layered all kinds
> of
> > stuff on this scene, and would follow the path you
> > indicate, among others.
> >
> >
> >
> >


 
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