NP - Toryism (Austerity) Isn't Working.

[bandwraith at aol.com]

These small scale approaches might actually
entail a fair amount of austerity on the personal
level- not a bad thing at all- and certainly quite
the opposite of what I imagine Toryism to be.


-----Original Message-----
From: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
To: Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>
Cc: P-list List <pynchon-l at waste.org>
Sent: Sat, Apr 28, 2012 7:02 pm
Subject: Re: NP - Toryism (Austerity) Isn't Working.


Yeah, these quiet little movements away from "pure" capitalism, without 
engendering twisted ideas of "communism" or "socialism" on a grand 
scale are a breath of fresh air. Like the old hippie dream growing up 
into real possibility. Discovering this movement actually made it 
possible for me to experience some momentary hope for humans.


On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 3:11 PM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:

We have a local transitions movement ,  still fragile but several of 
our events take place at or are sponsored by Williams College and it is 
good to see how many students are interested.  There is also a group in 
the region called northeastern permaculture  which is a web list for 
the growing interest in local permaculture design.   The gaia mind is 
 rich and available and real.

On Apr 28, 2012, at 5:21 PM, Ian Livingston wrote:

> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transition_Towns
>
> On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> 
wrote:
> I doubt we have yet entered the winter of global capitalism; so far 
we have just seen the big hole where the golden fang will be buried.. 
By the way I personally am ok with any system* that is ecologically 
sustainable and reasonably fair/just non-exploitive. That fair thing is 
really not just a moral issue, it's practical, humans evolved for 
millennia with sensible communal instincts.  The  current model of 
extractive growth and domination by military/economic exploitation has 
major problems and can only continue via a gruesome high tech 
feudalism.  That's the mindset of the US government , but such 
arrangements are clearly not viable at this time as Afghanistan, 
Vietnam, South America  Europe all show.    The corrupt america-modeled 
military-backed multi-national empire has to be cut down to size. 
 Reform does not look promising.   These big centralized bureaucracies 
will either make the planet uninhabitable or be replaced by smaller 
units of coherent culture, geography, and economic vitality.
>
> Where will the big changes come from? Violent  weather, 
eco-disasters, resistance to the hegemony of the dollar,  rising 
oceans, margin calls,  democracy and human rights movements, cost of 
energy, national bankruptcies, huge numbers of unemployed, resource 
battles( water, metals, rare earths, land, housing), tax resistance and 
more extreme actions.
>
>
> *(Paul Hawkin and Amory Lovins , borrowing heavily from Bill 
Mcdonough wrote an interesting book called natural capitalism that 
proposed a system which integrates principles of sustainability and 
eco-harmony with capitalism.They make a case for how it could work but 
the momentum of the existing system is not based on  rational decision 
making and there is no political interest in a harmonious balanced 
 long term economic system. )
>
> On Apr 28, 2012, at 3:18 PM, Paul Mackin wrote:
>
> >>
> >
> > If Winter's here can Spring be far behind
> >
> > p
>
>
>
>
> --
> "Less than any man have I  excuse for prejudice; and I feel for all 
creeds the warm sympathy of one who has come to learn that even the 
trust in reason is a precarious faith, and that we are all fragments of 
darkness groping for the sun. I know no more about the ultimates than 
the simplest urchin in the streets." -- Will Durant








--
"Less than any man have I  excuse for prejudice; and I feel for all 
creeds the warm sympathy of one who has come to learn that even the 
trust in reason is a precarious faith, and that we are all fragments of 
darkness groping for the sun. I know no more about the ultimates than 
the simplest urchin in the streets." -- Will Durant