Fwd: Re: Atdtda34: Details one had simply ignored, 954-956 #1

[Mark Kohut]

I would argue if pressed that TRP is satirizing Reef and others in ways that he does not Cyprian here....
Cyprian's experiences carry a whole lot of TRP's positive vision, I suggest.
 
And, re complexity....again, I think TRP might be largely "against it"....THAT is what modernity brought or modernity is what
came out of it. Of course, he/we have to deal with it...he does by dissing it.  
 
I remember History is a Step-Function in this regard. And that wasn't meant kindly but as a warning, imho.

From: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net>
To: pynchon-l at waste.org 
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 3:19 PM
Subject: Fwd: Re: Atdtda34: Details one had simply ignored, 954-956 #1

-------- Original Message -------- 
Subject: Re: Atdtda34: Details one had simply ignored, 954-956 #1 
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 15:18:58 -0500 
From: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net> 
To: Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> On 1/21/2012 1:20 PM, Mark Kohut wrote: 
I think Joseph's phrase that matters so to P's vision, abstractly stated....(You, Paul, and Joseph give it verbal depth) is
> 
>"very human"......
> 
>"simplified" matters too, imho....the complexification of the world is part of its self-destructive reality, I might
>argue Well, ONE kind of humanity, one that may suit Cyprian better at this point in his life than did the Cambridge-type humanity of his past. (as Paul notes) But the simple, tradition-oriented humanity found here in the Bulgarian countryside is less likely to be the sort that could ever to suit Reef or his descendents. Because being human also means being capable of complex problem solving, creating advanced technologies and even being political, this last being what Reef and his descendents seem to have their eyes on, including Ljubica, Reef's second chance, though I forget for the moment what ever does happen to Ljubica.But humanity does not have to be simple, and if complexity may be a danger to some aspects of it, that is no reason to change definitions.P 
From: Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>
>To: Pynchon Mailing List <pynchon-l at waste.org> 
>Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 12:11 PM
>Subject: Re: Atdtda34: Details one had simply ignored, 954-956 #1
>agree. Ljubica (meaning love or kiss)seems a very natural person born in a very human and simplified landscape of Bulgaria, the  oddly still center of the coming storm  where most of the weirdness is gone or external.The Balkan folk are aware of what is moving all around them but are settled into treasuring their own lives, roses, food, babies, song. Cyprian seems utterly wearied with desire, lusts, games, the great game, wars, maybe even deeper things like time or individuality.  On Jan 21, 2012, at 10:31 AM, Paul Nightingale wrote:> Ljubica's freedom is Reef's "second chance", another reminder of Jesse. The> current chapter has featured several such reminders, or repetitions, for> both Reef and Cyprian. For Cyprian, the text recalls his career to date:> "old Ratty McHugh" (932) and the narrative that opens up thereafter, "the> moment in Salonica ..." etc (939), Gabrovo Slim (947), the introspection of> "the only thing he could be certain of ..."
 etc (949), the recognition of> Vamos (951), the final paragraph of 64.12 (954). However, Reef has> frequently provided repetition-as-translation: "[k]ind of like Omaha" and> "five dollars" (945), "holding Jesse the first time" (950), the reference to> Kit (950), the "second chance" (954). For Reef, then, these moments do not> advance the narrative as they do for Cyprian. In particular, Cyprian is> isolated by introspection (949, 954), even though the narrative has been> driven by the characters that he (re)introduces. Cf his perspective on the> Halkata (955). Here, wandering ("as if blindly obeying a compass fatally> sensitive to anomaly") is juxtaposed to the certainties of fate: the> "raptors" that presage "what was soon to break over [the country]", followed> by the "local curse" that hastens Cyprian's recollection of "[t]he last time> I was out here". If Reef resists transformation, Cyprian sees local culture> as an alternative to the past: "Details
 one had simply ignored at Cambridge> or Vienna ..." etc.> 
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