Background for _Vineland_?

Tue May 22 11:53:13 CDT 2012

On 5/22/2012 12:39 PM, Madeleine Maudlin wrote:
> I disagree with everything you say about Aquinas.  Maybe the question is
> a little deeper than you're noticing.  Or you don't have a good answer,
> or even a valid answer.
>
> The stupid, undeep question, which neither you nor Orlando will answer,
> is why /you/ believe it.

I never said I believed it.  Was just saying why non "believing" folks 
can still identify as Christians.

But I see your point--I wasn't the right person to answer your 
question--you can't say why you believe something if you already don't.

P

  I understand fully why an uneducated and
> stupid child would believe it.  They're told to believe it.  But why
> /you/.  Who should by all sane accounts, know better.
>
> If neither you nor Michael are Protestants, or Christians, than forget
> about it.  Laugh at the pathetic Christians with me.  I only asked
> because I had decided that Bailey is a Protestant, and he said something
> about Protestants.  Great scholars, poor on the religion choices.
>
>
> On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 11:24 AM, Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net
> <mailto:mackin.paul at verizon.net>> wrote:
>
>     On 5/22/2012 10:17 AM, Madeleine Maudlin wrote:
>
>         I suppose you can't answer as to why Aquinas doesn't have his own
>         Church.  Who knows.  But why be a Protestant?  What's it do.
>           What good
>         is it.  Is it the Truth?  Path to eternal life in Heaven?  Do
>         Protestants believe in heaven?  What is a Protestant?
>
>         But more broadly, why be a Christian, is the question.
>
>
>     Because your parents were. Or more broadly because Western
>     Civilization was. It's a tradition thing.
>
>     If you're Jewish, it doesn't mean you believe in the religious
>     aspects or practice them.  So why not the same for Christians?
>
>     Aquinas didn't start his own church because he was quite happy with
>     the one that was already there . Switching from one Greek
>     philosopher to another doesn't really change Christian belief.
>       Philosophy is only a tool to try to clarify things with.
>
>     Any more of these deep questions need answerin'?
>
>     P
>
>
>
>         At first when I came across it on here I didn't believe it was a
>         serious
>         vibration, but now I believe that people on here are actual
>         Christians.
>           This is shocking to me, because I've always been largely under the
>         impression that well educated and intelligent people are /not/
>         Christians.
>
>
>         Does it fit your personality?  Are you interested in the
>         architecture?
>           Do you really think Jesus, the supposed Son of God, was nailed
>         to a
>         cross and died for your sins?  As that the clincher?  Does that
>         notion
>         turn you on?  Do you repent yours sins?  Or is that just for
>         Catholics...?
>
>
>         On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 9:38 PM, Michael Bailey
>         <michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com
>         <mailto:michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com>
>         <mailto:michael.lee.bailey at __gmail.com
>         <mailto:michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>
>             buncha good questions, here's another: that school that Mr
>         Pynchon
>             sent his son to and donated signed books to, isn't that a
>         Protestant
>             institution - I'm thinking Episcopal...
>
>             anyway, I was just opining - the Immaculate Heart College
>         kind of a
>             PR3 situation, struck me - I also do a lot of posting and
>         not enough
>             researching, but the nuns working out a new order of things
>         and then
>             getting shown the door and that wonderful college, of which
>         I think I
>             saw that Mary Tyler Moore was an alum, getting closed down, and
>             liberation theology falling victim to conservatism, and the
>         contras
>             supported by the right-wing beneficiaries of Vatican
>         conservatism,
>             gunning down that dude serving Mass, and that wonderful
>         priest who
>             tried to unionize his brethren getting read the Riot Act by
>         the wicked
>             Archbishop of Nottingham...
>
>             well it's the kind of stuff Protestants protest about, is how it
>             struck me
>
>             the jealous guarding of priestly prerogatives, the harsh
>         disciplines
>             and rigid hierarchies and the chauvinism
>             (and just perhaps, untoward side effects of celibacy...)
>
>             -- like the Senator from Utah who really thought the ERA
>         would spell
>             the end of the Republic, McIntyres was (the man who squats
>         behind The
>             Man who works the Soft Machine) the kind of person it's really
>             tempting to think ill of, the sender of emissaries like
>         Brock Vond...
>
>
>
>             On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 10:25 AM, Madeleine Maudlin
>         <madeleinemaudlin at gmail.com <mailto:madeleinemaudlin at gmail.com>
>         <mailto:madeleinemaudlin at __gmail.com
>         <mailto:madeleinemaudlin at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>          > I suppose I should have also inquired, is Pynchon a Protestant,
>             Aquinian?
>          >  Again, flying without clicking the links...
>          >
>          >
>          > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 8:59 AM, Madeleine Maudlin
>          > <madeleinemaudlin at gmail.com
>         <mailto:madeleinemaudlin at gmail.com>
>         <mailto:madeleinemaudlin at __gmail.com
>         <mailto:madeleinemaudlin at gmail.com>>>
>
>             wrote:
>          >>
>          >> What's a Protestant do again?  Why be Protestant?
>          >>
>          >> I ask because I had reason to consider Christianity for a few
>             minutes
>          >> yesterday.  Now here's a passing question: you had
>         neoPlatonism in
>          >> Christianity for what, the first half?  Then Aquinas brought in
>             Aristotle,
>          >> and made Christianity much, more sane, maybe, kind of like the
>             Protesters
>          >> did.  Why didn't Aquinas get his own branch of Christianity?  Or
>             did he?
>          >>  Are there Animist churches of Christ, is that the line they'd
>             be, are?
>          >>  Animist Catholics?
>          >>
>          >>
>          >> On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:26 AM, Michael Bailey
>          >> <michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com
>         <mailto:michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com>
>         <mailto:michael.lee.bailey at __gmail.com
>         <mailto:michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>          >>>
>          >>>
>         http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/__Sisters_of_the_Immaculate___Heart_of_Mary
>         <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisters_of_the_Immaculate_Heart_of_Mary>
>          >>>
>          >>> Must say (as a Protestant, and you're free to say similar stuff
>             about
>          >>> John Calvin and most definitely Martin Luther if you're a
>         Catholic)
>          >>> that McIntyre guy sounds like a real dick!
>          >>
>          >>
>          >
>
>
>
>             --
>         "Strength you will acquire naturally, if you do plenty of work; and
>             dexterity you will acquire unconsciously with practice; but
>         style you
>             can only acquire by constant attention, and then only if you
>         have a
>             clear idea of what to aim at." - A. F. Jenkin
>
>
>
>