NP, but a bit of prose poetry...

[Mark Sacha]

Yes, dispossessed probably strikes closer to home than what I wrote. And
many thanks for the link to the Sepich text.

As a film, I thought Counselor was pretty rotten, but I too liked the theme
that there is no such thing as undoing - "there is no other world". Of
course, there are your multiverses and what have you, but for this one,
seems sound enough. The world is all that is the case; the case, once it
occurs, can pass but never be un-cased.

On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 11:30 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com> wrote:

> Ballard again too, the car fucking.
>
> I came for mi esposa Penelope but stayed because I had a "bolito" round my
> neck and had to accept the reality of the world I was in.
>
> Despite the faults I thought it was an interesting flick. Would have been
> a better book than no country in my opinion. I would like to watch it with
> subtitles because I could not hear a lot of what was being said; saw it
> with friends who don't believe in them. They hated it, as predicted. I'd
> like to actually hear what the Sephardim and drug lord had to say but I
> couldn't.
>
> Interesting that the women in this one are like polar opposites, and one
> of them is the judge. My ears perked up at the excluded middle line too,
> iirc she was discussing options on the cartel, how to avoid dying, with
> Bardems character and they decide on going out to dinner.
>
> I also liked that the choice that condemned the counselor happens before
> the film starts. As if whatever the initiating event was it could have been
> as ambiguous as the decision to have coffee or tea one day.
>
> As for Vollmans tome, I would love to read it someday. The first review on
> that page M Sacha linked has a quote from the judge.
>
>
> On Thursday, December 17, 2015, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> just trivial "did ya know"?...McCarthy started SUTREE long before he
>> published at least his first two novels...took a long time and there
>> was/is, a huge amount
>> of manuscript from which it was hewn.
>>
>> and a repost about the movie of his script The Counselor
>> "is free on my TV so I watched it. You won't forget it easily if you do.
>>
>> But, Pynchon-relevant are two bits....One, first, is Pynchon the first
>> writer to put car-fucking into a novel? (The car plays a key role
>> in Gatsby and Harry Crews had a novel about a guy eating one) but
>> McCarthy ratchets up Pynchon's V. bit with an incredible scene wherein
>> Cameron Diaz fucks--spread-eagled, humping sensuously the windshield of a
>> car.
>>
>> Later in the movie as she talks to a guy about his options, she says,
>> "there's
>> the excluded middle'....."
>>
>> mark
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 10:20 AM, Ian Livingston
>> <igrlivingston at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > McCarthy writes about Man in the world. I think Suttree is a perfect
>> case in
>> > point. Man is dispossessed and sterile, his sex is fruitless (even with
>> > watermelons) and his copulations are with a form of Woman who no longer
>> is
>> > in the living world. I think the sterility of Man in his competitive
>> > commitment to violently wresting gratification from an unknown, barely
>> > guessed-at Other, that Man must hate in his ignorance, is
>> representative of
>> > all the sex McCarthy needs. Man fucks the world. Blood Meridian is,
>> yeah,
>> > genius; and, yes, it all comes back to the Whale as it is in the
>> postmodern
>> > world. There is a wonderful study, developed from a diss, I think,
>> > evaluating BM in part as a Tarot reading. Ah, yes, Notes on Blood
>> Meridian,
>> > by John Sepich. Highly recommended.
>> >
>> > http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3143478-notes-on-blood-meridian
>> >
>> > On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 6:40 AM, Mark Sacha <msacha1121 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> If you're interested in the topic, have the time, and have access to a
>> >> copy (the latter two are big ifs), Vollmann's unabridged Rising Up and
>> >> Rising Down is, I think, the de facto modern text on it. It's split up
>> into
>> >> two major sections - the first is analytical/theoretical and the
>> latter is
>> >> essentially an unedited compendium of his journalism, which are
>> included as
>> >> case studies. Only (haha) the first five volumes are really essential
>> to the
>> >> book. Since it's Vollmann we're talking about here, it's really
>> thorough,
>> >> although political in ways people won't always agree with and a little
>> >> inconsistent in tone and quality. But I was blown away by it.
>> >>
>> >> I got mine from a library since copies run upward of $1000.
>> >>
>> https://www.worldcat.org/title/rising-up-and-rising-down/oclc/53820538&referer=brief_results
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 9:12 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Been curious about Vollman for a bit
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thursday, December 17, 2015, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Now you have Vollman to read. A MAJOR subject, as we know.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 8:12 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>>> > I am nearing the end of another book on violence, not nearly as
>> epic
>> >>>> > or
>> >>>> > beautiful as BM but another perspective, psychological and
>> discrete. I
>> >>>> > have
>> >>>> > read Ballardian landscapes described as "quantal" and I think it is
>> >>>> > perfect
>> >>>> > description.
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > I think I am organically crafting some imaginary course on
>> violence in
>> >>>> > my
>> >>>> > head. Started with the Spanish film Tesis by Ameñabar,
>> Baader-Meinhoff
>> >>>> > by
>> >>>> > Delillo (it's a short story in the New Yorker, not necessarily
>> violent
>> >>>> > but
>> >>>> > terrorism and trauma) then Blood Meridian and now High Rise by
>> >>>> > Ballard.
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > On Thursday, December 17, 2015, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>> >>>> > wrote:
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> OMG that is so obvious! And the whole time reading it I am
>> >>>> >> constructing
>> >>>> >> wild theories as to why the man is hairless. Represents his
>> >>>> >> supernatural
>> >>>> >> otherworldliness, a skin suited for a different terrain, Yada yada
>> >>>> >> yada
>> >>>> >> can't believe I didn't consider the freaking whale itself.
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> I'm going to have to buy a copy because there is a lot I want to
>> go
>> >>>> >> back
>> >>>> >> to. Got mine from the library
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> And Mark that home alone bit is hilarious. Spot on.
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com
>> >
>> >>>> >> wrote:
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> I'm sure it is no accident the Moby Dick is so evoked by BM.  The
>> >>>> >>> Judge
>> >>>> >>> is the whale.
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> David Morris
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, Perry Noid <
>> coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>> >>>> >>> wrote:
>> >>>> >>>>
>> >>>> >>>> Moby Dick was at the front of my mind throughout. Instead of man
>> >>>> >>>> hunting
>> >>>> >>>> a whale, and everything that represents, man is hunting man. I'm
>> >>>> >>>> sure u all
>> >>>> >>>> have dissected this one like an injun scalp but since I haven't
>> >>>> >>>> really
>> >>>> >>>> discussed it with anyone I'll say this in passing to get it
>> out. I
>> >>>> >>>> think the
>> >>>> >>>> lack of sex scenes was certainly indicative of something
>> because we
>> >>>> >>>> know sex
>> >>>> >>>> occurs in the book. And I would like to know what anyone thinks
>> of
>> >>>> >>>> the
>> >>>> >>>> idiot, his cage and his chain to the judge and why the judge
>> >>>> >>>> rescues him.
>> >>>> >>>> One of the rare appearances of the fairer sex is when he is
>> >>>> >>>> liberated from
>> >>>> >>>> his cage. And just a random thought: when reading the passage
>> where
>> >>>> >>>> the
>> >>>> >>>> judge is walking around with the idiot on the chain my mind
>> seemed
>> >>>> >>>> to conjur
>> >>>> >>>> Dracula and Renfield. Was wondering what you smarter folk took
>> from
>> >>>> >>>> that
>> >>>> >>>> whole interaction.
>> >>>> >>>>
>> >>>> >>>> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, Keith Davis <kbob42 at gmail.com>
>> >>>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>>> >>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>> Yes, page 247.
>> >>>> >>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 8:26 AM, Perry Noid
>> >>>> >>>>> <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>> >>>> >>>>> wrote:
>> >>>> >>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>> I just finished reading that for the first time last week. Had
>> >>>> >>>>>> read
>> >>>> >>>>>> the Road and No Country, was underwhelmed, and was not
>> expecting
>> >>>> >>>>>> to be wowed
>> >>>> >>>>>> like I was with Blood Meridian. I was expecting it to be
>> another
>> >>>> >>>>>> over
>> >>>> >>>>>> praised novel that did not meet expectations but it far
>> exceeded
>> >>>> >>>>>> mine.
>> >>>> >>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>> That *is* Blood Meridian right?
>> >>>> >>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, Keith Davis <
>> kbob42 at gmail.com>
>> >>>> >>>>>> wrote:
>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>>> ...They rode on. The horses trudged sullenly the alien ground
>> >>>> >>>>>>> and the
>> >>>> >>>>>>> round earth rolled beneath them silently milling the greater
>> >>>> >>>>>>> void wherein
>> >>>> >>>>>>> they were contained. In the neuter austerity of that terrain
>> all
>> >>>> >>>>>>> phenomena
>> >>>> >>>>>>> were bequeathed a strange equality and no one thing nor
>> spider
>> >>>> >>>>>>> nor stone nor
>> >>>> >>>>>>> blade of grass could put forth claim to precedence. The very
>> >>>> >>>>>>> clarity of
>> >>>> >>>>>>> these articles belied their familiarity, for the eye
>> predicates
>> >>>> >>>>>>> the whole on
>> >>>> >>>>>>> some feature or part and here was nothing more luminous than
>> >>>> >>>>>>> another and
>> >>>> >>>>>>> nothing more enshadowed and in the optical democracy of such
>> >>>> >>>>>>> landscapes all
>> >>>> >>>>>>> preference is made whimsical and a man and a rock become
>> endowed
>> >>>> >>>>>>> with
>> >>>> >>>>>>> unguessed kinship.
>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>>> I'm sure some of you will recognize this...
>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>>> --
>> >>>> >>>>>>> www.innergroovemusic.com
>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>>
>> >>>> >>>>> --
>> >>>> >>>>> www.innergroovemusic.com
>> >>>> >>>>>
>> >>>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://waste.org/pipermail/pynchon-l/attachments/20151217/c4ef0ea9/attachment.html>