NP, but a bit of prose poetry...

[Ian Livingston]

The other two novels of the Border Trilogy are also interesting, if not as
brilliantly imagined. Both All the Pretty Horses and Cities of the Plain
are gritty and quite enjoyable.

On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 8:40 AM, Mark Sacha <msacha1121 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Yes, dispossessed probably strikes closer to home than what I wrote. And
> many thanks for the link to the Sepich text.
>
> As a film, I thought Counselor was pretty rotten, but I too liked the
> theme that there is no such thing as undoing - "there is no other world".
> Of course, there are your multiverses and what have you, but for this one,
> seems sound enough. The world is all that is the case; the case, once it
> occurs, can pass but never be un-cased.
>
> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 11:30 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Ballard again too, the car fucking.
>>
>> I came for mi esposa Penelope but stayed because I had a "bolito" round
>> my neck and had to accept the reality of the world I was in.
>>
>> Despite the faults I thought it was an interesting flick. Would have been
>> a better book than no country in my opinion. I would like to watch it with
>> subtitles because I could not hear a lot of what was being said; saw it
>> with friends who don't believe in them. They hated it, as predicted. I'd
>> like to actually hear what the Sephardim and drug lord had to say but I
>> couldn't.
>>
>> Interesting that the women in this one are like polar opposites, and one
>> of them is the judge. My ears perked up at the excluded middle line too,
>> iirc she was discussing options on the cartel, how to avoid dying, with
>> Bardems character and they decide on going out to dinner.
>>
>> I also liked that the choice that condemned the counselor happens before
>> the film starts. As if whatever the initiating event was it could have been
>> as ambiguous as the decision to have coffee or tea one day.
>>
>> As for Vollmans tome, I would love to read it someday. The first review
>> on that page M Sacha linked has a quote from the judge.
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, December 17, 2015, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> just trivial "did ya know"?...McCarthy started SUTREE long before he
>>> published at least his first two novels...took a long time and there
>>> was/is, a huge amount
>>> of manuscript from which it was hewn.
>>>
>>> and a repost about the movie of his script The Counselor
>>> "is free on my TV so I watched it. You won't forget it easily if you do.
>>>
>>> But, Pynchon-relevant are two bits....One, first, is Pynchon the first
>>> writer to put car-fucking into a novel? (The car plays a key role
>>> in Gatsby and Harry Crews had a novel about a guy eating one) but
>>> McCarthy ratchets up Pynchon's V. bit with an incredible scene wherein
>>> Cameron Diaz fucks--spread-eagled, humping sensuously the windshield of
>>> a car.
>>>
>>> Later in the movie as she talks to a guy about his options, she says,
>>> "there's
>>> the excluded middle'....."
>>>
>>> mark
>>>
>>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 10:20 AM, Ian Livingston
>>> <igrlivingston at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > McCarthy writes about Man in the world. I think Suttree is a perfect
>>> case in
>>> > point. Man is dispossessed and sterile, his sex is fruitless (even with
>>> > watermelons) and his copulations are with a form of Woman who no
>>> longer is
>>> > in the living world. I think the sterility of Man in his competitive
>>> > commitment to violently wresting gratification from an unknown, barely
>>> > guessed-at Other, that Man must hate in his ignorance, is
>>> representative of
>>> > all the sex McCarthy needs. Man fucks the world. Blood Meridian is,
>>> yeah,
>>> > genius; and, yes, it all comes back to the Whale as it is in the
>>> postmodern
>>> > world. There is a wonderful study, developed from a diss, I think,
>>> > evaluating BM in part as a Tarot reading. Ah, yes, Notes on Blood
>>> Meridian,
>>> > by John Sepich. Highly recommended.
>>> >
>>> > http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3143478-notes-on-blood-meridian
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 6:40 AM, Mark Sacha <msacha1121 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> If you're interested in the topic, have the time, and have access to a
>>> >> copy (the latter two are big ifs), Vollmann's unabridged Rising Up and
>>> >> Rising Down is, I think, the de facto modern text on it. It's split
>>> up into
>>> >> two major sections - the first is analytical/theoretical and the
>>> latter is
>>> >> essentially an unedited compendium of his journalism, which are
>>> included as
>>> >> case studies. Only (haha) the first five volumes are really essential
>>> to the
>>> >> book. Since it's Vollmann we're talking about here, it's really
>>> thorough,
>>> >> although political in ways people won't always agree with and a little
>>> >> inconsistent in tone and quality. But I was blown away by it.
>>> >>
>>> >> I got mine from a library since copies run upward of $1000.
>>> >>
>>> https://www.worldcat.org/title/rising-up-and-rising-down/oclc/53820538&referer=brief_results
>>> >>
>>> >> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 9:12 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Been curious about Vollman for a bit
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Thursday, December 17, 2015, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Now you have Vollman to read. A MAJOR subject, as we know.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 8:12 AM, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>>> >>>> wrote:
>>> >>>> > I am nearing the end of another book on violence, not nearly as
>>> epic
>>> >>>> > or
>>> >>>> > beautiful as BM but another perspective, psychological and
>>> discrete. I
>>> >>>> > have
>>> >>>> > read Ballardian landscapes described as "quantal" and I think it
>>> is
>>> >>>> > perfect
>>> >>>> > description.
>>> >>>> >
>>> >>>> > I think I am organically crafting some imaginary course on
>>> violence in
>>> >>>> > my
>>> >>>> > head. Started with the Spanish film Tesis by Ameñabar,
>>> Baader-Meinhoff
>>> >>>> > by
>>> >>>> > Delillo (it's a short story in the New Yorker, not necessarily
>>> violent
>>> >>>> > but
>>> >>>> > terrorism and trauma) then Blood Meridian and now High Rise by
>>> >>>> > Ballard.
>>> >>>> >
>>> >>>> >
>>> >>>> > On Thursday, December 17, 2015, Perry Noid <coolwithdoc at gmail.com
>>> >
>>> >>>> > wrote:
>>> >>>> >>
>>> >>>> >> OMG that is so obvious! And the whole time reading it I am
>>> >>>> >> constructing
>>> >>>> >> wild theories as to why the man is hairless. Represents his
>>> >>>> >> supernatural
>>> >>>> >> otherworldliness, a skin suited for a different terrain, Yada
>>> yada
>>> >>>> >> yada
>>> >>>> >> can't believe I didn't consider the freaking whale itself.
>>> >>>> >>
>>> >>>> >> I'm going to have to buy a copy because there is a lot I want to
>>> go
>>> >>>> >> back
>>> >>>> >> to. Got mine from the library
>>> >>>> >>
>>> >>>> >> And Mark that home alone bit is hilarious. Spot on.
>>> >>>> >>
>>> >>>> >>
>>> >>>> >> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, David Morris <
>>> fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>>> >>>
>>> >>>> >>> I'm sure it is no accident the Moby Dick is so evoked by BM.
>>> The
>>> >>>> >>> Judge
>>> >>>> >>> is the whale.
>>> >>>> >>>
>>> >>>> >>> David Morris
>>> >>>> >>>
>>> >>>> >>> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, Perry Noid <
>>> coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>>> >>>> >>> wrote:
>>> >>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> >>>> Moby Dick was at the front of my mind throughout. Instead of
>>> man
>>> >>>> >>>> hunting
>>> >>>> >>>> a whale, and everything that represents, man is hunting man.
>>> I'm
>>> >>>> >>>> sure u all
>>> >>>> >>>> have dissected this one like an injun scalp but since I haven't
>>> >>>> >>>> really
>>> >>>> >>>> discussed it with anyone I'll say this in passing to get it
>>> out. I
>>> >>>> >>>> think the
>>> >>>> >>>> lack of sex scenes was certainly indicative of something
>>> because we
>>> >>>> >>>> know sex
>>> >>>> >>>> occurs in the book. And I would like to know what anyone
>>> thinks of
>>> >>>> >>>> the
>>> >>>> >>>> idiot, his cage and his chain to the judge and why the judge
>>> >>>> >>>> rescues him.
>>> >>>> >>>> One of the rare appearances of the fairer sex is when he is
>>> >>>> >>>> liberated from
>>> >>>> >>>> his cage. And just a random thought: when reading the passage
>>> where
>>> >>>> >>>> the
>>> >>>> >>>> judge is walking around with the idiot on the chain my mind
>>> seemed
>>> >>>> >>>> to conjur
>>> >>>> >>>> Dracula and Renfield. Was wondering what you smarter folk took
>>> from
>>> >>>> >>>> that
>>> >>>> >>>> whole interaction.
>>> >>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> >>>> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, Keith Davis <kbob42 at gmail.com
>>> >
>>> >>>> >>>> wrote:
>>> >>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>> Yes, page 247.
>>> >>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 8:26 AM, Perry Noid
>>> >>>> >>>>> <coolwithdoc at gmail.com>
>>> >>>> >>>>> wrote:
>>> >>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>> I just finished reading that for the first time last week.
>>> Had
>>> >>>> >>>>>> read
>>> >>>> >>>>>> the Road and No Country, was underwhelmed, and was not
>>> expecting
>>> >>>> >>>>>> to be wowed
>>> >>>> >>>>>> like I was with Blood Meridian. I was expecting it to be
>>> another
>>> >>>> >>>>>> over
>>> >>>> >>>>>> praised novel that did not meet expectations but it far
>>> exceeded
>>> >>>> >>>>>> mine.
>>> >>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>> That *is* Blood Meridian right?
>>> >>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, December 16, 2015, Keith Davis <
>>> kbob42 at gmail.com>
>>> >>>> >>>>>> wrote:
>>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> ...They rode on. The horses trudged sullenly the alien
>>> ground
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> and the
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> round earth rolled beneath them silently milling the greater
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> void wherein
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> they were contained. In the neuter austerity of that
>>> terrain all
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> phenomena
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> were bequeathed a strange equality and no one thing nor
>>> spider
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> nor stone nor
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> blade of grass could put forth claim to precedence. The very
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> clarity of
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> these articles belied their familiarity, for the eye
>>> predicates
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> the whole on
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> some feature or part and here was nothing more luminous than
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> another and
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> nothing more enshadowed and in the optical democracy of such
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> landscapes all
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> preference is made whimsical and a man and a rock become
>>> endowed
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> with
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> unguessed kinship.
>>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> I'm sure some of you will recognize this...
>>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> --
>>> >>>> >>>>>>> www.innergroovemusic.com
>>> >>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>> >>>>> --
>>> >>>> >>>>> www.innergroovemusic.com
>>> >>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>> >
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>>
>>
>
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