Men Explain Lolita To Me

[Ray Easton]

But there is no "Lolita herself" -- only HH's construct, his creature.

[ I am not containing because I think we are going to reach agreement,  but 
because I find it an interesting exchange. :-) ]

Ray

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On December 18, 2015 4:38:05 AM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:

> I think to stop at calling it " about obsession" is to leave out essential 
> details, such as LOLITA ( mostly) herself and her ' meanings' by the end of 
> the book.
> But, as I said, we differ it seems.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Dec 18, 2015, at 5:31 AM, Ray Easton <raymond.lee.easton at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I should also have said:
>>
>> Lolita is *profoundly* amoral.  It's amorality is central to it,  critical 
>> to what it is about.
>>
>> Ray
>>
>> Sent with AquaMail for Android
>> http://www.aqua-mail.com
>>
>>
>>> On December 18, 2015 4:17:20 AM Ray Easton <raymond.lee.easton at gmail.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I was aware that you were alluding to words of HH himself -- all the more
>>> reason to be wary!  HH makes a fictional living out of manipulating the way
>>> we see him.
>>>
>>> And one ought to be especially wary in this case, given that the novel
>>> explicitly pokes fun at the view that this is a morality tale -- that is
>>> John Ray's view of the story!
>>>
>>> Lolita is indeed more than a stylistic exercise.  It is a presentation of
>>> obsession,  perhaps the best there is; certainly the best with which I am
>>> acquainted.
>>>
>>> The novel itself requires no "moral lesson" for its validation.  It is we,
>>> the readers, who want rather desperately to find such a lesson present --
>>> in this we are like HH himself. HH no doubt would say to us, while
>>> charmingly smiling,  "Hypocrite lecteur..."
>>>
>>> Ray
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>> On December 18, 2015 3:25:35 AM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Yeahp. One--I--can sound silly defending fictional " truth" in such a
>>>> writer. so it be. We differ. Nabokov's LOLITA would be nothing but a
>>>> stylistic exercise if he did not believe and show in the novel awareness
>>>> that pedophilia IS pedophilia. My perhaps lame remark on him " getting what
>>>> he deserves" was, if I remember correctly, a verbal allusion to Humbert's
>>>> very words as HE suggested his proper punishment, if you will remember.
>>>>
>>>> Totally amoral or whatever as you position re Nabokov , you will need to
>>>> explain Humber's recognition scene and subsequent awareness.
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 17, 2015, at 7:37 PM, Ray Easton <raymond.lee.easton at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> When I say 'Nabakov does not care a fig...' I am not referring to what the
>>>>> man in his "non-fic life" did or did not believe.  (I don't care about such
>>>>> things.)  I mean that his novels have no moral viewpoint and present no
>>>>> moral lessons.
>>>>>
>>>>> HH "gets what he deserves" -- you sound like John Ray, Jr., PhD.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ray
>>>>>
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>>>>> http://www.aqua-mail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On December 17, 2015 5:35:40 PM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> yeah, Nabokov greatly dissed 'morality' in fiction all his non-fic life...
>>>>>> but he did believe in themes and human goodness and badness..
>>>>>>
>>>>>> some take Nabokov's constant dissing of 'morality' as part-act (against
>>>>>> lousy, sentimental poshlost fiction) and part unreliable narrator...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, he recognized love and death and themes related to and life
>>>>>> and sense perceptions and
>>>>>> so much more in his own
>>>>>> and in others' fictions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2015 at 5:50 PM, Ray Easton
>>>>>> <raymond.lee.easton at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Morality -- Nabakov does not care a fig about morality.  And  the novel is
>>>>>>> designed to force us to identity not with Lokita, but with HH.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ray
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On December 17, 2015 4:40:02 PM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> we have to identify with Lolita because common human morality....to
>>>>>>>> read it right....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -
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>>
>>
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