Brilliantly, sadly observed

[ish mailian]

I never said that the mainstream media pastes the terrorist label on the
US. What I said and I stand by it, is that the US did not make, create,
give birth to ISIS. The US did not even, sort of,  function as some sort of
midwife in the birth of ISIS.

All else is Joseph looking to snag me in a fight I'm not interested in.



On Sun, Nov 29, 2015 at 11:48 AM, Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at gmail.com>
> Date: Sun, Nov 29, 2015 at 11:41 AM
> Subject: Re: Brilliantly, sadly observed
> To: Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>
>
>
> I don't recall seeing our mainstream media labeling our attacks
> "terrorist," but they certainly report on the various operations, including
> those with many civilian casualties.
>
> I believe that this kind of preference or leeway given our side over their
> side is just the way the world is. You would like something different I
> know.
>
> P
>
> On Sun, Nov 29, 2015 at 12:31 AM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:
>
>> Add unsophisticated, trite, worn out, muddled by the passions to the list
>> of insults which are supposed to be some kind of argument.
>>
>> Show me where mainstream media is pasting the terrorism label on the
>> West.  I assume since this is so common you could come up with several
>> examples. One maybe? Or do you just make this shit up?
>>
>> >
>> >> On Nov 28, 2015, at 11:12 AM, ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> My bad. The arguments advanced are unsophisticated, too focused on the
>> rants and sound bites, the trite and worn out phrases in the media. We, the
>> US, did not give birth to ISIS. Repeating this mantra of the media, pasting
>> the terrorism label on the West...etc.... undermines the thesis, one that I
>> agree with, but one that requires that the facts are set out and not
>> muddled by the passions.
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Nov 27, 2015 at 8:14 PM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net>
>> wrote:
>> >> These are not arguments, they are insults; sound bite, rant, hand
>> wringing, naive.  You are not getting published, and are not a respected
>> political voice and there are many highly qualified observers who say
>> fundamentally what I am saying. This POV is not a product of naivety but of
>> sane and equable moral evaluation. You talk as though The US army and
>> commerce brings peace and stability wherever it goes, but there is a
>> shitload of evidence against that premise. It is the mainstream press that
>> is suspect and produces reams of meaningless propaganda and is most often
>> caught lying, along with the military.
>> >>> On Nov 27, 2015, at 3:41 PM, ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Did we pretty much midwife an Islamic state? No. We did not. That is
>> sound bite.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Fri, Nov 27, 2015 at 1:17 PM, David Kilroy <
>> thesaintgodard at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> Considering we pretty much midwived the existence of the Islamic
>> State I don't think we merit much understanding.
>> >>>
>> >>> Not for a second saying the terrorists are right, but I understand
>> precisely why we're perceived as the great satan.  Our government has done
>> everything in its power to destabilize the middle east, murder & impoverish
>> hundreds of thousands of people and it's an absolute fucking disgrace.
>> >>>
>> >>> http://thedollop.libsyn.com/122-the-iraq-war
>> >>> ​
>> >>> Professional comedians can't even manage to make jokes about it.
>> It's just an abysmal state of affairs.  Our government has made its
>> citizenry complicit in wars where we refuse to keep a body count or allow
>> ourselves to be held accountable to international law.  We've held POWs for
>> over a decade without trial.  How has that made us secure?  MY GOVERNMENT
>> HAS MADE ME COMPLICIT IN WAR CRIMES.  The people in Guantanamo are
>> hostages, political pawns who have been abused physically & mentally, and
>> no amount of therapy will heal that.  Call me naive all you want: this shit
>> matters.  We look like fucking barbarians.
>> >>>
>> >>> The U.S. hasn't made things any more secure.  It's made American
>> citizens targets wherever we go: U.S. policies have created a climate of
>> hatred & danger for citizens traveling abroad.  It's infuriating.  We're
>> losers for believing we're in any way righteous.
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> -
>> >> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>> >>
>> >
>>
>> -
>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>>
>
>
>
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