Pynchon's censored file aesthetic

Fri Sep 1 02:00:36 CDT 2017

this visitation isn't white but strange:

http://renaissance.mrugala.net/Pontormo%20(par%20Fontaine%20S.)/Pontormo%20-%20La%20Visitation.jpg

If you come to Carmignano you can see it in San Michele.

2017-09-01 1:38 GMT+02:00 jesse gooch <jlguuch at gmail.com>:

> You mean the sense that I’m not “getting it” isn’t just me missing the
> references? Feeling better already.
>
> On Aug 31, 2017, at 6:55 PM, Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> No matter how many times you read these passages, it feels like there's
> something you're missing.  Maybe you are supposed to not be privy. Strange
> trick for an author to pull. But who's to say.
>
> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 5:24 PM, jesse gooch <jlguuch at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Really interesting take on it. I like the idea that there has
>> been…interference or something, between what was said and what we actually
>> receive. Cool notion Kid.
>>
>> > On Aug 31, 2017, at 5:11 PM, ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Oh yeah, Kid, I hear you now. The Godzilla! example helped me
>> > understand what you are getting at. Very cool, Kid. Cool Beans!
>> >
>> > Keep it up Kid and you might be teaching a film class in Pynchon any
>> day now.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 4:49 PM, da kid <peterock86 at live.com> wrote:
>> >> Oh I know what I was thinking of: overdubbed voices! Like ...
>> Godzilla! I
>> >> got the same impression during some of the rocket parts like when
>> Slothrop
>> >> is talking to Katie about the rocket and she looks at him with pity or
>> like
>> >> she knows something he doesn't. I don't remember the scene exactly and
>> don't
>> >> have a copy with me but it's at the casino Hermann Goering. I was
>> thinking
>> >> Slothrop possibly could have said something else more personal but the
>> >> readers "hear" the dubbed voice. I don't know if he was going for
>> anything
>> >> like this- I doubt it. But I liked the idea that passages of Gravity's
>> >> Rainbow had been bleeped out and dubbed over. Like a confidential CIA
>> file
>> >> if they not only marked over words with a black marker but added new
>> words
>> >> on top.
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> From: owner-pynchon-l at waste.org <owner-pynchon-l at waste.org> on behalf
>> of
>> >> Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at gmail.com>
>> >> Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2017 3:16:50 PM
>> >> To: ish mailian; pynchon -l
>> >> Subject: Re: Pynchon's censored file aesthetic
>> >>
>> >> TP's choices in naming things and people are so right they can cause
>> you to
>> >> quiver.
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 1:30 PM, ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> The Rocket and the Whale: A Critical Study of Pynchon’s Use of
>> Melville
>> >>> Author:Levitsky, Zhana
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 1:29 PM, ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>> The Whiteness of visitations from Above, from Below, and later the
>> >>>> White Finality and the whiteness of the rocket/whale....our
>> postmodern
>> >>>> friends used to call this symbolic use over-determined and our
>> >>>> mathematical friends might call it an overdetermined system.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> The death and life and grace configurations are infinite at least.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> God's Grace can do wonders.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> In Catholicism, it is held that the purpose of this visit was to
>> bring
>> >>>> divine grace to both Elizabeth and her unborn child. Even though he
>> >>>> was still in his mother's womb, John became aware of the presence of
>> >>>> Christ, and leapt for joy as he was cleansed from original sin and
>> >>>> filled with divine grace. Elizabeth also responded and recognised the
>> >>>> presence of Jesus, and thus Mary exercised her function as
>> >>>> mediatrixbetween God and man for the first time.[1]
>> >>>>
>> >>>> 1.  Holweck, Frederick. Visitation of the Blessed Virgin Mary. The
>> >>>> Catholic Encyclopedia. Vol. 15. New York: Robert Appleton Company,
>> >>>> 1912. 11 Oct. 2013
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 12:06 PM, Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at gmail.com
>> >
>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>>>> Correction: Looking it up, I find "visitation" in Catholic parlance
>> >>>>> refers
>> >>>>> to Mary's visit to her cousin Elizabeth, mother to be of John the
>> >>>>> Baptist.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 11:35 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com>
>> >>>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> YES!....
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 11:30 AM, Paul Mackin <
>> mackin.paul at gmail.com>
>> >>>>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> "White Visitation" a code name, always appearing in double quotes,
>> >>>>>>> stands
>> >>>>>>> for something secretive, namely  this inter-governmental
>> long-named
>> >>>>>>> organization whose purpose is supposed be to try out any
>> outlandish
>> >>>>>>> scheme
>> >>>>>>> anyone can think of that might possible contribute to winning the
>> >>>>>>> war.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> The name itself sounds plausibly like a Catholic hospital or
>> convent.
>> >>>>>>> Angel Gabriel appearing to the BVM.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 10:32 AM, Atticus Pinecone
>> >>>>>>> <atticuspinecone at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Like a symbol?
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> As for technique, is it far fetched to think he used Burroughs's
>> cut
>> >>>>>>>> up
>> >>>>>>>> style? They have similarly snarled syntax.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> On Aug 30, 2017, at 8:55 PM, da kid <peterock86 at live.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> Ok so I made a pretentious title for this post which is pretty
>> >>>>>>>>> much
>> >>>>>>>>> just a random idea/question. When I was reading Gravity's
>> Rainbow
>> >>>>>>>>> I got the
>> >>>>>>>>> feeling that some of his proper names particularly The White
>> >>>>>>>>> Visitation were
>> >>>>>>>>> like, the possible term escapes me, words inserted after the
>> true
>> >>>>>>>>> name had
>> >>>>>>>>> been erased. Like if you are listening to a recording of someone
>> >>>>>>>>> talk and he
>> >>>>>>>>> keeps mention someone but when he says that name a computer
>> voice
>> >>>>>>>>> chimes in.
>> >>>>>>>>> God this is the worst attempt at explanation. But anyways I was
>> >>>>>>>>> wondering if
>> >>>>>>>>> maybe this idea could connect to Pynchon's "layering" technique
>> of
>> >>>>>>>>> writing.
>> >>>>>>>>> Any thought?
>> >>>>>>>> -
>> >>>>>>>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>> -
>> >>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>> >>
>> >>
>> > -
>> > Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l
>>
>> -
>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?listpynchon-l
>>
>
>
>
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