Russian Collusion

Tue Sep 18 22:55:10 CDT 2018

Allegations of murder are "factually correct?"  You probably mean
"characterizations" are correct, because that's all you've got.  In the
60's in the US being a hippie meant you probably liked commies.  Same broad
brush.

David Morris

On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 10:21 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:

> I refuse to edit, much less read, P-list posts full of barrages of linked
> stories from sources I don't know. Too much work for me...
>
> So I missed the sharp answer you quote.  Is there a context in the text
> that belies this simplicity?
>
> David Morris
>
> On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 8:45 PM peterthooper at juno.com <
> peterthooper at juno.com> wrote:
>
>> although the post was mostly quotes, didn't this, seemingly emanating
>> from Mr Eckhart, about 1/2 way down:
>>
>>  "This seems to be a very sensible statement. Whatever Manafort did, he
>> did
>> > not "smear" Tymoshenko. The allegations are factually correct."
>>
>> directly respond to your question?
>>
>>
>> ---------- Original Message ----------
>> From: David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>> To: Thomas Eckhardt <thomas.eckhardt at uni-bonn.de>
>> Cc: P-list <pynchon-l at waste.org>
>> Subject: Re: Russian Collusion
>> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2018 05:55:08 -0500
>>
>> Lots of words, but not an answer to my question.
>>
>> David Morris
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 2:24 AM Thomas Eckhardt <
>> thomas.eckhardt at uni-bonn.de>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 15:50:22 -0500
>> >   David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > Are there any P-listers who think that Manafort is being
>> > >framed?  That he
>> > > didn't collude w/ Russia to promote Yanukovych in US
>> > >diplomatic circles by
>> > > smearing  Tymoshenko as anti-Semitic?
>> >
>> > "On 19 October 2012, Batkivshchyna and Svoboda signed an agreement for
>> > 'the
>> > creation of a coalition of democratic forces in the new parliament'."
>> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-Ukrainian_Union_%22Fatherland%22
>> > There can be no doubt that Svoboda is a Fascist party. It was founded in
>> > 1991 under the name Social-National Party of Ukraine by Oleh Thyahnybok
>> > and
>> > (the much more important) Andriy Parubiy and used the Wolfsangel of the
>> > 2nd
>> > SS Panzer Division 'Das Reich' as its emblem. The Wolfsangel is the
>> > Ukrainian version of the swastika.
>> > Here is the European Parliament in December 2012:
>> > "Parliament goes on to express
>> > concern about the rising nationalistic sentiment in Ukraine, expressed
>> in
>> > support for the Svoboda Party, which, as a result, is one of the two new
>> > parties to enter the Verkhovna Rada. It recalls that racist,
>> anti-Semitic
>> > and xenophobic views go against the EU's fundamental values and
>> principles
>> > and therefore appeals to pro-democratic parties in the Verkhovna Rada
>> not
>> > to
>> > associate with, endorse or form coalitions with this party."
>> >
>> http://www.europarl.europa.eu/oeil/popups/summary.do?id=1239823&t=e&l=en
>> > Svoboda's leader, Oleh Thyahnybok, was "expelled from the Our Ukraine
>> > parliamentary faction after he made a speech in the Carpathian Mountains
>> > at
>> > the gravesite of a commander of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. In the
>> > speech,
>> > which was aired on television in the summer of 2004, he made comments
>> such
>> > as,
>> >   " [You are the ones] that the Moscow-Jewish mafia ruling Ukraine fears
>> > most."
>> > and
>> > "They
>> >
>> > were not afraid and we should not be afraid. They took their automatic
>> > guns
>> > on their necks and went into the woods, and fought against the
>> Muscovites,
>> > Germans, Jews and other scum who wanted to take away our Ukrainian
>> state."
>> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oleh_Tyahnybok
>> > In 2013, Thyahnybok was barred from entering the US because of his
>> > anti-semitic views:
>> >
>> >
>> https://forward.com/news/breaking-news/179415/ukrainian-far-right-nationalists-barred-from-us-fo/#ixzz3TzHrdPDj
>> > To sum up: There can be absolutely no doubt that Svoboda is a fascist,
>> > anti-Semitic party and that Tymoshenko's "Fatherland" formed an alliance
>> > with it as early as 2012.
>> > In reaction to the agreement between "Fatherland" and Svoboda, the
>> Israeli
>> > Foreign Ministry issued a statement:
>> > "The Oct. 27, 2012, statement from the Israeli Foreign Ministry said the
>> > country was 'concerned about the growing extremist anti-Semitic forces
>> in
>> > Ukraine' and cited the partnership agreement. 'Israel is concerned about
>> > the
>> > recently signed agreement between the Batkivshchyna Party and the
>> > extremist
>> > Freedom Party, whose anti-Semitic attacks repeatedly aroused resentment
>> > both
>> > in Ukraine and in Israel,' the statement from Liberman’s office read.'
>> >
>> >
>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bada-bing-bada-boom-paul-manaforts-attempt-to-smear-a-jailed-ukrainian-politician/2018/09/14/c5ac93b6-b837-11e8-a2c5-3187f427e253_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.3859bea101ed
>> > This seems to be a very sensible statement. Whatever Manafort did, he
>> did
>> > not "smear" Tymoshenko. The allegations are factually correct.
>> >
>> > This is from May 2018:
>> > "A wave of anti-Semitism has swept over Ukraine. In the past three weeks
>> > alone, a far-right leader publicly called for cleansing Ukraine of zhidi
>> > (a
>> > slur equivalent to “kike”); a Holocaust memorial in Ternopil was
>> > bombed; hundreds marched through Lviv, in honor of an SS unit, complete
>> > with
>> > Nazi salutes; “Death to Zhidi” graffiti was scrawled in two cities; a
>> > revered rabbi’s tomb was vandalized; a Romani camp in Kiev was attacked
>> > and
>> > burned by far-right nationalists, and hundreds rocked out at a neo-Nazi
>> > concert clad in swastikas and throwing up Nazi salutes.
>> > (...)
>> > Ukraine is currently witnessing an unprecedented new surge of
>> > anti-Semitism.
>> > Last month alone, there were over 12 well-documented incidents of
>> > anti-Semitism. It must stop. pic.twitter.com/o6Cmm3LLCt— (((WJC)))
>> > (@WorldJewishCong) May 3, 2018
>> > (....)
>> > Over the past four years of Poroshenko’s presidency, Ukraine has
>> > experienced
>> > a steady growth of anti-Semitism, including the glorification of Nazi
>> > collaborators, vandalism of Jewish sites and public threats against
>> Jews —
>> > and the rate of anti-Semitic incidents appears to be escalating."
>> >
>> >
>> https://forward.com/opinion/401518/violent-anti-semitism-is-gripping-ukraine-and-the-government-is-standing/
>> > Meanwhile the US have started to train and arm the Azov Battalion which
>> > operates under, you guessed it, the Wolfsangel:
>> > "The Azov men use the neo-Nazi Wolfsangel (Wolf’s Hook) symbol on their
>> > banner and members of the battalion are openly white supremacists, or
>> > anti-Semites. "
>> > The former leader of the Azov Battalion is Andriy Biletsky:
>> > "A former history student and amateur boxer, Mr Biletsky is also head of
>> > an
>> > extremist Ukrainian group called the Social National Assembly. “The
>> > historic
>> > mission of our nation in this critical moment is to lead the White Races
>> > of
>> > the world in a final crusade for their survival,” he wrote in a recent
>> > commentary. “A crusade against the Semite-led Untermenschen."
>> >
>> >
>> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/11025137/Ukraine-crisis-the-neo-Nazi-brigade-fighting-pro-Russian-separatists.html
>> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andriy_Biletsky_(politician)
>> > If you want to see officers of the US Army fraternizing with neo-Nazis
>> and
>> > learn a little more about Andriy Parubiy:
>> >
>> >
>> https://grayzoneproject.com/2018/02/05/max-blumenthal-us-is-arming-neo-nazis-in-ukraine/
>> >
>> >
>> https://therealnews.com/stories/ukrainian-fascist-leader-speaks-in-us-congress-while-nazis-launch-racist-attacks
>> >
>> >
>> https://therealnews.com/columns/the-us-is-arming-and-assisting-neo-nazis-in-ukraine-while-congress-debates-prohibition
>> > >It's not what I'd call the Left.
>> > Well, one thing is for certain: It is not the Nazi-arming,
>> > anti-Semites-supporting, Al-Qaeda-at-the-risk-of-WW-III-protecting,
>> > John-McCain-adoring, CIA-and-FBI-trusting and Neoconservative "Left".
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> --
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>>
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>