NP but Somehow Pynchonian to me. Dreams in the Third Reich.

Sat Nov 9 18:41:35 UTC 2019

The article is interesting. I’m not an advocate of the political right but I don’t see the rise of fascism, or authoritarianism just yet... I see populism certainly, and lack of consensus, but the more fundamental drive (now) is a categorical rejection by both the far Left & Right of Liberalism with a capital L. 

Robert Paxton’s The Anatomy of Fascism (an enlightening book recommended on the P-List) provides a detailed synthesis on the 20th Century Fascist movements... 

I don’t think we’re at the Griffith’s “Palingenetic Ultranationalism” point yet, nor is there a WWI level crisis that would bring these nascent movements to the forefront...yet...
https://books.google.com/books/about/The_Anatomy_of_Fascism.html?id=JU3th4LnKvsC&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button

Attached below is an interesting article on the political right in France:
https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2018/12/20/two-roads-for-the-new-french-right/

Also below is an interesting podcast with Sam Harris ( yes, yes I know... But him and Eric Weinstein are the only out of the so called IDW cohort whom I’m not convinced is a total fraud... but I could be wrong) 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 9, 2019, at 7:08 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> There is an American woman asking Americans about their dreams since
> 2016. I'm sure it is findable if you are interested.
> 
> More than you might care to know, but not that embarrassing or revealing.
> For more reasons than the uncertainty and bad shit of our polity and times,
> I have been dreaming
> of being lost and struggling, struggling to even move and then not being
> able to get back.
> One Jungian dream, I say, about entering some kind
> of transport machine that landed me in Canada,  where I went to college as
> i've written, and I could not get back (but I kept trying to find the
> transport station) .
> As we know, many Americans went and stayed in Canada in the politically
> turbulent sixties.
> 
> And lately, after a personally volatile day and a volatile newsday, I was
> caught in the wilds of nature, with cliffs to slide down and trying to move
> in mud--
> this part surely comes from Margaret Atwood's *Surfacing*--and when I awoke
> the Sinatra song from Joker, *That's Life*
> were the first words in my mind.
> 
> Art isn't life unless you make it so.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIiUqfxFttM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, Nov 8, 2019 at 8:27 PM Mark Thibodeau <jerkyleboeuf at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
>> Fascism's ongoing rise has certainly had an effect on my own dreams
>> and nightmares, that's for sure.
>> 
>> I find that my "dream self" is less certain of pretty much everyone he
>> encounters in dreams, be they friend, family, or composite. I have
>> more difficulty trusting these dream people, and they seem less
>> capable of being reasoned with. I've had many dreams of people
>> harboring hidden agendas and feeling more free to share their
>> "politically incorrect" (i.e. fascist) opinions about, say, people of
>> a different race, or people with a different set of political beliefs.
>> 
>> I feel as though a big part of the New Fascist International(e)
>> "project" has been the inoculation of the minds that they've targeted
>> for takeover against facts, reason, truth, evidence, crushingly
>> overwhelming expert consensus, etc, etc, etc... they just DO NOT CARE
>> that they're wrong. It's an infantile regression, one that could only
>> ever have happened in a society where the stakes have been made to
>> seem not all that important (again, purely an illusion).
>> 
>> I don't know. I'm rambling now. All this to say that, YES, the current
>> crisis has personally affected me, right down to my dreams. Not really
>> sure where I stand anymore.
>> 
>> Cheers;
>> Yer Old Pal Jerky
>> (YOPJ)
>> 
>> On Fri, Nov 8, 2019 at 6:31 AM Kai Frederik Lorentzen
>> <lorentzen at hotmail.de> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> "Yes, sort of GERMAN, these episodes here. Well, these days Slothrop is
>>> even dreaming in the language. Folks have been teaching him dialects,
>>> Plattdeutsch for the zone the British plan to occupy, Thuringian if the
>>> Russians happen not to drive as far as Nordhausen, where the central
>>> rocket works is located."
>>> 
>>> Gravity's Rainbow, p. 240
>>> 
>>> Inspired by Beradt's book, the historian Reinhart Koselleck had a
>>> research program running on human experiences of time in times of terror
>>> & the methodological consequences for history science. Koselleck wasn't
>>> able to finish the overall project but there's an essay from the 1970s
>>> where his basic considerations can be found:
>>> 
>>> Reinhart Koselleck: Terror und Traum. Methodologische Anmerkungen zu
>>> Zeiterfahrungen im Dritten Reich. Pp. 278-299 in R.K.: Vergangene
>>> Zukunft. Zur Semantik historischer Zeiten. Frankfurt a.M. 1979: Suhrkamp.
>>> 
>>> The essay collection - "Future's Past: On the Semantics of Historical
>>> Time"  (NY 2004: Columbia University Press) - is available in English.
>>> Here comes the pdf:
>>> 
>>> 
>> https://www.academia.edu/33539151/Futures_Past_On_the_Semantics_of_Historical_Time_-_Reinhart_Koselleck_2014_1985_
>>> 
>>> The essay "Terror and Dream. Methodological remarks on the experience of
>>> Time during the Third Reich" can be found on pages 205-221.
>>> 
>>> "Traumdarstellungen aus den Konzentrationslagern eröffnen uns einen
>>> Bereich, wo der menschliche Verstand zu versagen scheint, wo seine
>>> Sprache verstummt. Die konzentrationären Träume zeichnen sich durch
>>> einen rapiden Verlust an Wirklichkeit aus, während Wachträume
>>> proportional dazu zunehmen. Damit werden wir in einen Bereich gestoßen,
>>> in dem offenbar die schriftsprachliche Quellenlage unzureichend wird, um
>>> überhaupt begreifen zu lernen, was der Fall war. Wir werden auf die
>>> Metaphorik der Träume verwiesen, um sehen zu lernen, was wirklich
>> geschah."
>>> 
>>> (pp. 288-289, here quoted after the fourth paperback edition from the
>>> year 2000)
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Am 08.11.19 um 08:06 schrieb Mark Kohut:
>>>> https://twitter.com/NewYorker/status/1192490281687568384?s=20
>>>> --
>>>> Pynchon-L:https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>>>> .
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>> 
> --
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