Not BE Reread. America runs on less than 2/3 fossil fuels. Down even more since 2015 but can't find succinctly.

Sun Nov 14 10:44:37 UTC 2021

Oh.  You found his point?  Well, I guess I didn’t see the point of his
point.

*Your point was*:  The US still generates about 1/3 of its electricity from
coal (but that’s soon to decline).

*His point was*:  Yeah, but we still burn a shitload of oil and gas for all
sorts of other necessary stuff.

*More to that point,  you both could have just said*:  COP26 was a big
failure, and we’re all pretty well fucked (but most of us will be dead
before it gets too real).

*And as Rich points out*:  We’re all complicit.

But if you want a bunch of climate facts (points!!!) to make yourself into
a real drag at the next party, download this:

Free eBook: The Good Guide to Effective Climate Action in the 21st Century:
“ You know climate change is a problem [right?], but what do you do next?
This 99-page guide rounds up all you need to know about how (and why) to
measure, reduce and offset your emissions—and help build a better future.”

But…
Oh, well…
That’s better than NOTHING.

David Morris

On Sun, Nov 14, 2021 at 5:03 AM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:

> Good point.
> Here is a more thorough answer, using the last year for which we have total
> reliable stats:
> In 2018, those “fossil fuels” fed about 80% of the nation’s energy demand,
> down slightly from 84% a decade earlier. Although coal use has declined in
> recent years, natural gas use has soared, while oil’s share of the nation’s
> energy tab has fluctuated between 35% and 40%.
>
> https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/01/15/renewable-energy-is-growing-fast-in-the-u-s-but-fossil-fuels-still-dominate/
>
> I'll look for late 2021 info. Maybe another year of reliable stats have
> been generated. If so, and it is 2020, we know everything went
> down....temporarily. Risen again this year...
>
> On Sat, Nov 13, 2021 at 7:38 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:
>
> > That’s just electricity. What about fertilizer, gas for farm equipment,
> > lawnmowing, shipping, oil refining, driving, flying, heating oil,
> > manufacturing
> > equipment that runs on gas or oil, plastics, diesel trucking? There is
> > also greenhouse gases released from concrete. These are not trivial
> sectors
> > of the economy.
> >
> > On Nov 13, 2021, at 2:34 PM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Coal <http://needtoknow.nas.edu/energy/energy-sources/fossil-fuels/coal/
> >
> > In 2015, *33.2% of U.S. electricity* came from coal— roughly equal to
> > natural gas (32.7%), but greater than nuclear power (20%) or renewable
> > energy sources (13%).
> > There is an abundant supply of coal in the United States and it’s a
> > relatively inexpensive energy source, but it is declining in use. What
> are
> > the costs of mining and burning this resource and is there a good way to
> > address them?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 6:34 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Said what I wish to say in earlier posts. Lost interest. Moving on.
> >>
> >> > On Nov 12, 2021, at 6:19 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > So wank away in protest, and pretend your reasoning has any connection
> >> to anything other than identifying as a protester.  But you don’t even
> do
> >> that for real.
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 5:55 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net
> <mailto:
> >> brook7 at sover.net>> wrote:
> >> > Of course it translates into global warming. The economy runs on
> fossil
> >> fuel.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> On Nov 12, 2021, at 3:56 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com
> <mailto:
> >> fqmorris at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Um…
> >> >>
> >> >> 1. A “hot” economy doesn’t translate into global warming. *That
> sounds
> >> like something Ted Cruz might say in a speech to idiots*. Now THAT you
> >> might call a put down.
> >> >>
> >> >> 2.  Would you rather that we have a “cold” economy (in order to slow
> >> global warming?)?
> >> >>
> >> >> 3.  If you want to make “usury” QE into an evil, deceptive force
> >> that’s causing us to all see our hard-earned household safety and money
> >> melt away from our fingers, then what monetary strategy would you have
> >> implemented to try to claw back from the COVID recession which was
> greater
> >> than the 2008 Great Recession?
> >> >>
> >> >> David Morris
> >> >>
> >> >> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 3:22 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net
> >> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> wrote:
> >> >> Just want it to be clear that I am not opposed to  paper money  at
> >> all. The real issue for me  is putting usury and the financial industry
> >> backed by fossil fuels/petrodollars and the war industry at t he center
> of
> >> the economy. The result may indeed be what David Morris’s reference
> calls a
> >> hot economy , but it is a heat that is all too real and is burning down
> >> the biosphere.  Numbers are not the same as  breathable air, safe
> >> temperatures, clean water, food and shelter and friendship and music
> >> making. All the zeroes and ones in the universe do not add up to life.
> When
> >> your money that you worked just as hard for this week as last is losing
> >> value in almost every area, that is inflation. and that comes from an
> >> imbalance between dollars and real stuff.
> >> >>   The fossil fuel companies contiue to get government support even as
> >> they dump billions of tons of waste material into air and ground that
> they
> >> are stealing from the earth and her people for use as a toxic waste
> dump.
> >> >>
> >> >> > On Nov 12, 2021, at 2:20 PM, Richard Romeo <
> richard.romeo at gmail.com
> >> <mailto:richard.romeo at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I think much the same, Joseph. The fossil fuel industry are nations
> >> unto themselves. And I’m not sure any President has much sway over them
> if
> >> we still have renewable energy still in its young adulthood and with
> >> nuclear in and out and back in of the picture.
> >> >> > I don’t think of QE as good or bad, just another tool in the
> toolbox
> >> to spur economic growth in times of lackluster economic trends.
> >> >> > But the US does still have the advantage of the dollar containing
> to
> >> be the global base currency and we can tweak here and there
> >> >> > I don’t see anyone going back to the gold standard. Money has been
> >> let loose. I can’t see how that genie gets back in the bottle. It’s so
> >> intertwined in the global economy now.
> >> >> > I think all this ties into the irrelevance of nation states. Sure
> we
> >> have borders but money doesn’t.
> >> >> > With that said, The US still has flexibility and control over its
> >> economy and currency. But it’s not a given with the current dysfunction,
> >> cynicism and corruption in the US today.
> >> >> > The US does need to invest in its infrastructure and in social
> >> programs. Which will benefit on many different levels, personal social
> and
> >> political. But not with the current leadership as is, much of it on the
> >> Republican side. It was bad enough when Reagan said govt was the
> problem;
> >> it’s gone way past that now. But we need govt to work. I’m not keen on
> >> Weimar comparisons but the hollowing out of effective governance is
> pretty
> >> clear
> >> >> >
> >> >> > rich
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> On Nov 12, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net
> >> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Apologies for name fumble. too many commentators out there. My
> >> main point is I am highly dubious Biden will be seriously challenging
> the
> >> US fossil fuel industry in any substantive way.  I could certainly prove
> >> wrong but things don’t look good to me. Agree not relevant to BE. Not
> that
> >> important.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>> On Nov 12, 2021, at 10:30 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com
> >> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> It isn't Ignatious, it's Yglesias and his point is not about all
> >> that....
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> Biden has already changed some of the dynamics....
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> Otherwise, I'm not engaging since this is a good BE Read and
> >> everyone's interpretative analyses may differ.
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>>> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 10:21 AM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net
> >> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:
> >> brook7 at sover.net>>> wrote:
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>> define “imaginary money.”
> >> >> >>> Basically when money is released into circulation that has no
> >> corresponding economic growth/new value. Many economists from different
> >> political positions and economic biases have questioned the benefits of
> >> Quantitative Easing as a solution to any and every sign of economic
> >> faltering. Already China and other countries are pulling away from the
> >> dollar  and Tbills as overvalued.  Tying up metals as markers of wealth
> >> seems like a waste of gold, silver, whatever as highly useful and
> >> decorative material. But people  around the world buy gold against
> >> inflation and it works pretty well. Also indebting the tax base to ever
> >> increasing military budgets is draining value from currency at a time
> when
> >> ecological threats far far outweigh military threats.  Passive solar
> houses
> >> and business buildings are a far better hedge against inflation than
> >> truckloads of high tech weapons that lose wars.  Locally grown food and
> >> locally made necessities the best hedge agains attenuated  fossil fuel
> >> dependent supply lines.
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> IMO Ignatius is fantasizing if he thinks Biden is going to
> >> challenge the oil companies. Look at COP; look at the pipelines. The
> dollar
> >> = oil.
> >> >> >>> Food is grown with fossil fuels, delivered with fossil fuels,
> >> wrapped in fossil fuels and converted into debt measured in fossil
> fuels.
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>>>> On Nov 12, 2021, at 9:12 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com
> >> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:
> >> fqmorris at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>> Please define “imaginary money.”
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>> Like, as opposed to gold or something?
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>> I can’t wait for this…
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>> David Morris
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>>> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 8:54 AM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net
> >> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:
> >> brook7 at sover.net>> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>
> >> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>>> wrote:
> >> >> >>>> Maybe not price gouging but when goverment pumps tons of
> >> imaginary money into the economy it starts to lose value. Quantitative
> >> Easing was the phrase.
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>>> On Nov 12, 2021, at 7:12 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com
> >> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:
> >> mark.kohut at gmail.com>> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:
> >> mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:
> >> mark.kohut at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
> >> >> >>>>>
> >> >> >>>>> Love in the Time of Web3, Pynchon is smiling when he saw
> that....
> >> >> >>>>>
> >> >> >>>>>
> >> >> >>>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>>>>
> >> >> >>>>> Matthew Yglesias
> >> >> >>>>> @mattyglesias
> >> >> >>>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>>>>
> >> >> >>>>> ·
> >> >> >>>>> 12m <
> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389
> >> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389> <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389>> <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389> <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <
> >> https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389>>>>
> >> >> >>>>> Agree with Robinson — you can’t take the politics out of
> >> politics! Biden
> >> >> >>>>> should also investigate price-gouging and anti-competitive
> >> behavior by
> >> >> >>>>> retail gas stations and have the FTC ask if cartel-like
> behavior
> >> by oil
> >> >> >>>>> company shareholders is restraining supply.
> >> >> >>>>> --
> >> >> >>>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>>
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >>>> --
> >> >> >>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>>
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> --
> >> >> >>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> --
> >> >> >> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>
> >> >
> >>
> >> --
> >> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>
> >
> >
> --
> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>