more Ukraine research and thoughts.

[Mark Kohut]

And, in three pages of googling I have found reporting from Eastern
Ukraine, not networks of course which is another cheap shot,  low-level
shots akin to faves of yours and I even found a Pew
Research Poll.....

On Thu, Jan 27, 2022 at 1:23 PM Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:

> You missed remarking that what happens when Russian troops move in, if
> they do, will not be good for anyone, esp the Ukranians.
>
> Ukraine is a sovereign country. *Ukraine
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine>* was one of the founding members
> of the *United Nations <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations>* when
> it joined in 1945 as the *Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Soviet_Socialist_Republic>*;
> along with the Byelorussian Soviet Socialist Republic
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byelorussian_Soviet_Socialist_Republic>,
> Ukraine signed the  United Nations Charter
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Charter> when they were
> part of the Soviet Union <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union>.
> After the dissolution of the Soviet Union
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissolution_of_the_Soviet_Union> in 1991,
> the newly independent Ukraine retained its seat.
>
> Ukraine is entitled to all the rights under the UN Charter for States,
> Article 2 mostly but all of them. I think.
>
> If NATO did not exist, Ukraine has the right NOT to be violated in its
> sovereignty. Russian troops are escalating shooting at the borders. You can
> project whatever you want about what entities you hate---not Russia---MIGHT
> do, but this is the international law case, more clear than Trump's treason.
>
> On Thu, Jan 27, 2022 at 12:59 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:
>
>> So maybe the people in the Donbass were fighting with the Ukrainian
>> government for the heck of it. I don’t know who is putting forth the
>> ‘purest’ fiction, but it’s not like the networks are trying real hard to
>> find out what the people in eastern Ukraine are thinking.
>>
>> As far as who loves geopolitical bull, how is the push for NATO not
>> geopolitical bull? Isn’t that the real heart of this. That Russia is saying
>> no more Nato encroachment. I don’t believe there is any credible evidence
>> that agreeing that Nato will stay out of Ukraine would result in Russia
>> trying to take over Ukraine.
>>
>> So today the US made clear they are ignoring Russia’s position on Nato.
>> This could effectively be the end of anything like negotiation.  What
>> happens when Nato troops move in is not likely to be good for anyone.
>> '
>> > On Jan 27, 2022, at 10:03 AM, Martin Dietze <mdietze at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > On Thu, 27 Jan 2022 at 15:49, Johnny Marr <marrja at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> and you’re not backing up your points with evidence
>> >>
>> >
>> > Neither are you.
>> >
>> > What probably separates the two of us is me having spent a considerable
>> > amount of time in various parts of Ukraine over the last 25 years,
>> speaking
>> > fluent Ukrainian and understanding Russian rather well and living
>> amongst
>> > Ukrainians where I am now.
>> >
>> > You can choose to trust me on this.
>> > You can also do the research yourself by talking to a representative
>> number
>> > of Ukrainians instead.
>> > What you should better not do is believe what "alternative media",
>> > geopolitics-loving bloggers and the like write about the country. 90% of
>> > that stuff is pure fiction.
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> >
>> > m.
>> > --
>> > Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>>
>