Ukraine

[Martin Dietze]

On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 at 03:51, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:

> *Your only valid point is that ‘ethnic Russians’ is an oversimplification *


Thank you for appreciating me having a valid point. Seems like you know a
lot about Ukraine so that you can tell who's right and who's wrong?


*though there are many ethnic Russians and there is a great deal of
> intermarriage and a strong majority who speak Russian which is a  cultural
> statement.*


Plain wrong. I mentioned that you want to learn about the region's history
which you obviously haven't.

Regarding the use of the Russian language: the reason for its dominance in
urban areas (and only there) is different from what you think.
And it is not a cultural statement. It is the consequence of certain
historic developments you are ignorant about.


* The thing is they did not accept the coup as valid and were attacked both
> culturally and militarily after the coup.*


Nonsense. There was no coup. The word "coup" is straight from the Kremlin's
text books, and you see no problem in sharing their narrative while
believing that you have a more "objective" view than others? Come on.

Indeed Eastern Ukraine was attacked militarily - Russian special forces
entered the country after their job in Crimea had been finished, started
occupying public buildings and handing out weapons to people who happened
to be interested. Little later tanks and GRAD rocket launches were seen on
the streets. *That's* what I call a military attack.

Unlike you who are relying on your "alternative media" (of which a vast
portion simply took over the Kremlin's narrative) I actually know a good
number of people from Donetsk and Luhansk who clearly contradict your
story.


* They also led the original fighting with  actual Ukrainian fascists who
> adorn themselves with Nazi insignias and regulalrly heroize Stephan Bandera
> . The people of the Donbass fought and  voted for their current status  and
> continue to defend their choices. *
>

Plain bullshit. The people of Donbass were never asked. You constantly
writing about "the people of Donbas" doing this or that shows pretty well
that (a) you don't have a clue about what the people of Donbass are
actually like and (b) don't see a problem in adopting the narrative of a
power that had just annexed one part of the country and has had its
military in another part since then. With all your conspiracy stuff it
never occurred to you that they may not have an interest to tell you the
truth?

Whatever happened there in early 2014 was decided in Moscow. The story
about Ukrainian "fascists" is pretty ridiculous, too, in particular when
you look at all the Russian volunteer militant units with people recruited
in motherland Russia. By far the larger number of people with nazi world
views have been fighting on the Russian side right from the start. Hence
claiming their fight was "anti fascist" is as ridiculous as it is now when
Lavrov and co are claimiing to "denazify" Ukraine (and Europe).


* Calling the professional observers of the UN sponsored OCSE “Rascist"
> propagandists is a pretty low level of argument.*


Which I am not doing.


* But that seems to be what you are left with.*
>

This coming from you is getting funnier with every word. Somebody who is
completely ignorant about Ukraine, its history, its demographic, its
politics, relying vastly on pro-Kremlin sources, not even able to read any
single first hand source in original must surely be the person to unveil
"the truth" to others. Ouch.

-- 
Dr. Martin Dietze
[https://www.martins-braindumps.de/]

1. Vorsitzender - Deutsch-Ukrainischer Kulturverein e.V.
Голова - Німецько-Українське Товариство Культури
[http://www.deutsch-ukrainischer-kulturverein.de/]

Redakteur / Редактор - Karpaty Lviv Nachrichten
[https://karpaty-lviv-nachrichten.com]