COL 49 CH 5 Arrabal to Hilarius and arrival of cops

Tue Jul 16 13:00:29 UTC 2024

I look at episodes like this Maxwells Demon play, and see an extended
joke-riff. Serious around the edges, filled with role reversal and pun,
crazy logic… and I think they’re mostly stand-alone chapters.  Comic relief
sideshow.  ATD has a few LARGE sections that are like this.  And I think
TRP would have benefited from a tough editor in that case.

On Tue, Jul 16, 2024 at 8:20 AM J K Van Nort via Pynchon-l <
pynchon-l at waste.org> wrote:

> Mark sez:
> The dead man, Pierce...   "Like" (equals?).....Maxwell's Demon....????
> Rather than equals, perhaps more simile, comparing unlike things. They
> both manipulate information but for different reasons. Maxwell's demon to
> create energy, Pierce to create wealth. Again the coincidence of seeing
> Jesus after having learned about entropy and Maxwell's demon, Oed begins to
> relate how Pierce has used money to create power with how an idea can
> create energy or lead to entropy. The demon can no more escape entropy than
> the wealthy man can escape death.
> On another note, since we are discussing Pierce's ability to curate
> Oedipa's experiences, it is worth asking to what extent Pierce knew about
> his death. Was it a surprise or was it expected? In order to curate on any
> level we're discussing means that he must have known his death was
> imminent. Is there any textual evidence to answer this?
> In solidarity,James
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Tuesday, July 16, 2024, 02:45, Michael Bailey <
> michael.lee.bailey at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Nice breakdown. Respectful response:
>
> My theory of the novel is not to take it too seriously.
>
> Primary goal of CoL49: to be a novel, in the  novelistic tradition. An
> entertainment.
>
> Everything between the covers serves that end.
>
> For me, it was entertaining earlier to speculate that the estate might be
> broke & try to prove it (came up pretty short but it was a learning
> experience.)
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 15, 2024 at 1:37 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net> wrote:
>
> > I guess I just don’t see how anyone could predict or stay ahead of her
> > enough to know what bus she would take or where she would sit on the bus.
> > Her pattern of movement was crazily erratic or arbitrary.
>
>
> Exactly when people are easiest to manipulate.
>
>
> Also what would be PI’s motive in all this?
>
>
>
> The hypothetical Harlequinish novel that I was projecting would have Pierce
> intensely loving her, and putting her thru all this so she would go to the
> auction, where he would have his hand-picked new love interest for her
> declare himself and Oedipa find him acceptable.
>
> I wouldn’t necessarily prefer, after reflection, such a plot, but I did
> like that episode of (Cumberbatch) Sherlock, where one watches as Watson
> enacts every single thing just as Sherlock had planned, unlikely as it
> seems - that’s part of the enjoyment.
>
> I see this whole line of thought as the kind of paranoia that is desperate
> > and illogical and ascribes an impossible level of power and manipulative
> > skill to the presumed controller of events. Once a person sees any such
> > deception in a powerful person or organization it is hard not to wonder
> how
> > much of that is directed at you.  It seems rather to me that Pynchon is
> > carefully presenting a story where the protagonist is stirred to
> > investigate something that looks highly unlikely but is found to be so
> real
> > and troubling that she can barely cope, and looks for any possible
> > explanation.
> >
>
> Yes, but is that fun?
>
> I agree that both the “broke PI” and the “lovelorn puppet master” aren’t
> very satisfying theories
>
> But bouncing around, using those now proven-wrong deviations to get off the
> beaten path - because I’m not enchanted by the sort of grim conclusions we
> seem to be heading for - I like the idea that Oedipa uses the executrix gig
> to skive off from Wendell’s pointless drama and infidelities - then uses
> the Tristero as an excuse to skive off from boring estate duty -
> then skives off from diligent sleuthing - to a stamp auction where maybe
> Genghis (or maybe even Pierce himself, in rags or a sari & turban, behind a
> Bertie Wooster kind of glue-on beard, having faked his death) will show up
> & turn out to be a gratifyingly adept hair-climber.
>
> Because I’m yes, earnestly reading and not rejecting other interpretations,
> but essentially I dip into a novel in the first place as a way to skive off
> from grimness, to receive both “sentens and solas” - and never stop looking
> for that.
>
> There’s a tension between the desire to be responsive to the text as it is,
> and the desire to find the specific things I want to read about, which is
> enjoyable.
>
> The many quite good comments here I’ve been reading are undoubtedly more
> responsive to the text than the ideas I’ve been floating!
>
> But I keep wanting to read this as a fun book without completely ignoring
> its contents.
>
>
> > Also if we assume that PI did set all this up and also made sure that the
> > evidence of this large secret network  would be made to disappear early
> in
> > the disposition of the will, I would argue that this leads to something
> > very much resembling the course of events following the Kennedy killing
> and
> > the scope of the efforts to prevent contrary evidence and testimony to
> the
> > magic bullet riddled narrative of the Warren commission, including the
> high
> > likelihood the Dorothy Kilgallen was murdered and her files stole. Maybe
> a
> > plausible for-instance  type explanation of what PI could have been up to
> > and why he would have set up this elaborate and expensive illusion, would
> > give more credibility to this idea.
>
>
> Love; crazy love
>
> I honestly can’t think of how that would work to explain the events of the
> > story. P does not have human villains without human motives. Is it
> really a
> > parable where PI is the Devil( Ala the world the flesh and the devil)?
> What
> > is his goal as a devil? I’m really trying to think this through with
> > everything on the table so far.
> >
> >
> >
> I think - I hope - that positing PI as a devil is tongue-in-cheek, he’s
> just a rich dude with his flaws, nobody’s perfect
>
> And although Oedipa’s anguish is real, her situation within the spectrum of
> human experience is enviable - she’s a modern embodiment of one of the
> Aristotelian ideas about having the characters be of high social status or
> something like that…she’s got internal class to move in many circles &
> think worthy thoughts even in her confusion while she keeps moving (and
> skiving)
>
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> --
> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>
>
>
> --
> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>