decadanse bis

Wed Jul 10 21:53:32 CDT 2002

Simon, Gregory, apologies for that most outlandish Doug impersonation. 
You´re completely correct.

--Monica

>From: "Simon Bryquer-RR" <sbryquer at nyc.rr.com>
>Reply-To: "Simon Bryquer-RR" <sbryquer at nyc.rr.com>
>To: "Monica Belevan" <meet_mersault at hotmail.com>,   
><alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr>
>CC: <pynchon-l at waste.org>
>Subject: Re: decadanse bis
>Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:49:49 -0400
>
>This last reply (though reply is not quite right word for an uncalled
>admonishment ) has a strange familiar echo of someone else.
>
>SCB
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Monica Belevan" <meet_mersault at hotmail.com>
>To: <alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr>
>Cc: <pynchon-l at waste.org>
>Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 9:50 PM
>Subject: Re: decadanse bis
>
>
> >
> > Gregory, we may talk as soon as you stop disemboweling things from their
> > contexts. Learn to read and synthetize information. It may take you a 
>good
> > few years.
> >
> > >From: alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr
> > >Reply-To: alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr
> > >To: pynchon-l at waste.org
> > >Subject: decadanse bis
> > >Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:08:24 +0200
> > >
> > >hey monikuh
> > >
> > >well i agree with what you say, i was just pointing out that when you
> > >look into it, there is a difference between poètes maudits and
> > >parnassians and symbolists. If mallarmé and verlaine are
> > >  related to parnasse, they were mavericks (as opposed to dull
> > >  parnassians like, say, gautier)  and ducasse sure
> > >couldn't be related to any of those parisian circles. could it be
> > >that we secretly agree but still anjoy playing the very french sport of
> > >"couper
> > >les cheveux en quatre", monique?
> > >
> > >gregory
> > >
> > >MB> Yes, Gregorovius, but if we are going to reduce everything ad
>absurdum
> > >ad
> > >MB> nauseam, then we better discuss Husserl and solipsism, or 
>ourobouros,
> > >or
> > >MB> algebraic reversibilities.
> > >
> > >MB> I appreciate the link, I´ll fish through it soon. Perhaps the 
>system
>in
> > >MB> France is different; however, in the chronology of literary 
>history,
> > >the
> > >MB> peak manifestations of the decadent spirit are set in the
> > >MB> Parnassian-Symbolist intervals. It´s not set in stone, Gregor, but
>it´s
> > >MB> fairly consensual.
> > >
> > >MB> --Monica
> > >
> > >
> > > >>From: alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr
> > > >>Reply-To: alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr
> > > >>To: pynchon-l at waste.org
> > > >>Subject: la décadanse
> > > >>Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:48:06 +0200
> > > >>
> > > >>hey monica,
> > > >>
> > > >>décadence (or anything, for that matter) can be traced back forever,
>you
> > > >>know, if you want to go
> > > >>there. you're the one who mentioned it in relation to the
> > > >>"poètes maudits" and the 19th century, so i was just pointing out 
>that
> > >here
> > > >>it's not
> > > >>really what we understand by décadents, but something more specific,
> > > >>but that's ok monica, and i actually know what you mean (and agree)
>but
> > >we
> > > >>just
> > > >>don't use the same terms, you see. In France. Not my fault. No
> > > >>affectation here or whatever. That's how we learn about it. I swear.
> > >Check
> > > >>this out for
> > > >>example (i don't know if you read french):
> > > >>http://www.bmlisieux.com/curiosa/jtellier.htm
> > > >>Get my point?
> > > >>oh and please, when you're done looking down on me, dear, could you
> > >start
> > > >>spelling my name right?
> > > >>thank you
> > > >>
> > > >>Grégory (not Grégoire, i used to beat people up for that one...
> > > >>just kidding(i figure i should make that clear, seeing how natural
> > > >>humor is around here...)!)
> > > >>MB> Gregoire-- ´´decadentism´´, is, in fact, the art of supreme
> > > >>affectation, and
> > > >>MB> if you are merely picking at the smaller threads and timelines 
>you
> > >only
> > > >>have
> > > >>MB> part of the picture. More than decadent art ( a contradcition in
> > >terms,
> > > >>MB> perhaps?), there is a decadent cosmovision. That is precisely 
>what
> > > >>MB> Parnassians, Symbolists and even French proto-Surrealists like
> > > >>Lautreamont
> > > >>MB> share, that special disposition, that agriculture of spleen. The
> > >term
> > > >>itself
> > > >>MB> is English and was coigned by Baudelaire, who set the definitive
> > > >>antecedent
> > > >>MB> for this form of aestheticism. If you trace it further back, you
> > >shall
> > > >>MB> discover a rich Gothic influence as well. Abridging the 
>decandent
> > > >>esprit to
> > > >>MB> schools and petit comites, however, testifies to your own
> > >affectation,
> > > >>and
> > > >>MB> fails to do much justice to it´s historical import in the
> > > >>reconstruction of
> > > >>MB> aesthetics.
> > > >>MB> This was all discussed to some extent in recent p-list postings,
>´´
> > >The
> > > >>MB> Aesthetics of Ugliness´´.
> > > >>
> > > >>MB> David-- I don´t have either M&D or V. with me, so it is 
>impossible
> > >for
> > > >>me to
> > > >>MB> address you an answer as punctually as I would like to. No less, 
>I
> > >was
> > > >>MB> referring to a more global atmosphere to Pynchon´s texts. To
>reading
> > > >>the
> > > >>MB> Pynchon that Paul likes to read, he´s the Pynchon I like best as
> > >well.
> > > >>And
> > > >>MB> your quotations testify to this. If you read them, as they are,
>you
> > > >>will
> > > >>MB> notice that V.´s intrinsic polyhedric architecture makes of
> > >Decadence
> > > >>an x
> > > >>MB> variable, a term of multipe acceptations, and shifting
>affectations
> > >as
> > > >>well.
> > > >>MB> One of the quotations, in fact, even points to a particular
>vitality
> > >in
> > > >>MB> decadence:
> > > >>
> > > >>MB> ´´This sort of arranging and rearranging was Decadence, but the
> > > >>exhaustion
> > > >>MB> of all possible permutations and combinations was death." 298
> > > >>
> > > >>MB> I do not believe we disagree.
> > > >>
> > > >>MB> Love, Monica
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>MB> 
>_________________________________________________________________
> > > >>MB> MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
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> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>--
> > > >>Best regards,
> > > >>  alfredjprufrock
> > > >>mailto:alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >MB> _________________________________________________________________
> > >MB> Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: 
>http://messenger.msn.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Best regards,
> > >  alfredjprufrock
> > >mailto:alfredjprufrock at club-internet.fr
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
> >
> >

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