Back to AtD Cyprian again

[Mark Kohut]

So, here's a more generalized probably stupid observation/question. East augers bad shit in a number of later
Pynchon works, just as North is cold, dead, less fit for humans.....South: tropics, warmth, bananas, beaches
is good and in AtD especially and Inherent Vice by setting, West is good, akin to South. 
 
Could this be a pattern? Why was the Anarchist Enclave west? We might know why it was 'at the foothills of
the Pyrnees as a trope......

From: Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at verizon.net>
To: pynchon-l at waste.org 
Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2012 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: Back to AtD Cyprian again


On 7/22/2012 10:31 AM, Ian Livingston wrote:

Eh? Yeah. Makes sense. I was forgetting the setting of the scene. Having just unpacked my Burke and been drawn into reading a few paragraphs, I might have thought to apply his careful system here. Which, I think, would support this reading. Even so, I'd have to wonder about the larger resonances of the scene as apostrophe. Just because it's Pynchon and he does that sort of thing now and then. Well, and because I like to see such.
>

Yes and east of there is the Balkans, to which Cyprian vowed never to return. I'm assuming this isn't a first reading for anyone, but if is skip down to avoid a possible spoiler













The seemingly-inseparable four DO return, and Cyprian decides to stay on as a nun at the Covent in Thrace.  I wondered a second if his decision was connected to his resignation to the fact that he was loosing his sexual attractiveness, but quickly decided there was little if any connection.

P


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>On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>First I decided to ask myself where Cyprian was? Although he is speaking of The Balkan Peninsula here, he is talking to Ratty
>>and he may still be in Ys-les Bain, yes? "Hidden near the foothills of the Pyrenees", which, double-checking a map shows that WW 1 begins (and is largely fought) East of there. Invasion of Bosnia starts it and more........
>>
>>
>>From: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
>>To: Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> 
>>Cc: pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org> 
>>Sent: Saturday, July 21, 2012 6:03 PM 
>>
>>Subject: Re: Back to AtD Cyprian again
>>
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>>Sorta combining the two, given Cyprian's fate and all: if the Communist rebellion can be thought of as atheistic (following Feuerbach, as Marx does, one might call the projected deity atheistic), could that be that which is to feared by such as Cyprian? Is it his fate to station himself at the last outpost of devotion to the mystery? 
>>
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>>On Sat, Jul 21, 2012 at 2:24 PM, Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>First para sez well stuff on my mind....
>>> 
>>>But, reading further after "relaxing into his fate' shows equanimity, I think....acceptance of getting older, of no longer desiring the young, etc....
>>>
>>>
>>>From: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
>>>To: Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> 
>>>Cc: pynchon -l <pynchon-l at waste.org> 
>>>Sent: Saturday, July 21, 2012 4:28 PM
>>>Subject: Re: Back to AtD Cyprian again
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I remember being a little inclined to caution on reading this. Not always one of my more prominent characteristics. What IS in the east? The Great War in Europe was not an Eastern thing, really, as I understand it, but the mortal spasm of the Empire succumbing to the triumph of capitalism, and all very European from start to finish (counting the US as essentially European on another continent, and an ally of the European capitalist class.) The war in the East was different. That was two great empires in extremis struggling for renewed footing, room to expand, and all that fun stuff. The only thing "building" in the east was the communist rebellion in Russia.
>>>
>>>Equanimity is central to Buddhism. Is Cyprian's relaxation into fate an expression of equanimity, or is it fatalistic? The two can be very different. Hm. How close am I re-reading AtD?
>>>
>>>
>>>On Sat, Jul 21, 2012 at 1:10 PM, Mark Kohut <markekohut at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>p. 939 "only some form of madness would take anyone east, right now. into the jaws
>>>>of what's almost certainly on the move out there." 
>>>>What is he alluding to? the Repressed returning? War?, the Building-up? The Force of They?
>>>>
>>>>Lower down on 939:
>>>>"Cyprian had begun to 'relax into his fate' " 
>>>>What means this? Nietzsche is one who is famous for the concept of accepting--loving, embracing-- one's fate. Amor Fati. 
>>>>Nabokov is another, along with some ancient Greek dramatists and 
>>>>This bracketed phrase in AtD does not show up except in Pynchon (and one unknown writer)'s allusion. 
>>>>Does Pynchon even give Nietzsche's concept a laid-back framing? Wiki calls Cyprian's response Buddhist.
>>>>
>>>>Has Cyprian gone beyond (society's) good and evil Nietzsche-like. Is that where Buddhism lies? 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>-- 
>>>"Less than any man have I  excuse for prejudice; and I feel for all creeds the warm sympathy of one who has come to learn that even the trust in reason is a precarious faith, and that we are all fragments of darkness groping for the sun. I know no more about the ultimates than the simplest urchin in the streets." -- Will Durant
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>-- 
>>"Less than any man have I  excuse for prejudice; and I feel for all creeds the warm sympathy of one who has come to learn that even the trust in reason is a precarious faith, and that we are all fragments of darkness groping for the sun. I know no more about the ultimates than the simplest urchin in the streets." -- Will Durant
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>-- 
>"Less than any man have I  excuse for prejudice; and I feel for all creeds the warm sympathy of one who has come to learn that even the trust in reason is a precarious faith, and that we are all fragments of darkness groping for the sun. I know no more about the ultimates than the simplest urchin in the streets." -- Will Durant
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