NP - What Occupy Did to 2012, What It Will Do to 2013

[Markekohut]

At the barest minimum, as Ian wrote, Occupy Sandy seems to be a leader in spontaneous, anarchistic -like help for sufferers of the Storms...



Sent from my iPad

On Nov 11, 2012, at 12:53 PM, malignd at aol.com wrote:

> I have no dog in this fight, but am skeptical about how much of an impact OWS had on the election or on anything else.  I work on WS every day and have watched and wondered and never was able to reach a conclusion.  Their energy a year ago was impressive and moving, their message garbled and often incoherent.  Certainly they garnered media attention, but that is difficult to translate into actual achievement.
> 
> The most recent incarnation is an embarrassment -- an exhausted skid row of the vagrant and seemingly brain dead and hapless, camped out, filthy and exhausted, in front of Trinity Church to no effect other than to engender, alternatively, pity and loathing.  Hard to see them having any influence on anything in 2013.
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bled Welder <bledwelder at gmail.com>
> To: Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
> Cc: David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>; rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com>; P-list <pynchon-l at waste.org>
> Sent: Sun, Nov 11, 2012 12:29 pm
> Subject: Re: NP - What Occupy Did to 2012, What It Will Do to 2013
> 
> How fucking old are you, Livingston?  Come on.  Stick out your lizard lips and show these stupid humans how old you are.
> 
> On Sun, Nov 11, 2012 at 11:18 AM, Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I think one of the greatest factors OWS contributed was its impact on the youth vote. Once the movement responded to the problems of planted agents provocateurs, homeless followers, and police brutality by evolving beyond a protest movement into a political movement, their attractiveness to young voters increased dramatically, I suspect (extrapolating from the young people I know--which is a very small sample), and they put effort into getting out the vote. Then, of course, the work they've done post-Sandy made front pages again, again with positive associations. The message remains the same: it's up to us to change things because the government has become unresponsive to the wishes and needs of the people. That resonates clearly in these times.
>> 
>> On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 2:39 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> No need to prolong this.  But prior to OWS, despite polls showing the public didn't care about deficit reduction, that was the only thing the GOP harped on, and Obama wasn't disagreeing much.  OWS IMHO very effectively turned the conversation to economic just, not austerity.  Europe still doesn't get that one.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 3:28 PM, rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> most people polled said deficit reduction wasn't one of their major
>>>> concerns. Jobs and others were. I'm not saying OWS didnt raise some
>>>> sort of awareness but so much of what people were feeling they were
>>>> feeling so personally (their wages, retirement funds, etc.) that even
>>>> without OWS around their votes wouldn't be any different from the
>>>> election results.
>>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 3:10 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > Occupy successfully changed the predominant conversation from deficit
>>>> > reduction to income  and opportunity inequality. THAT's what Pierce is
>>>> > talking about, and Romney's 47% secret recording played into occupy
>>>> > perfectly.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 12:55 PM, rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I think tha'ts a stretch. u didnt need a weatherman...etc etc. I think
>>>> >> many people were plain insulted by the Romney clap trap--they didnt
>>>> >> need a movement to tell them not to vote for him. it's also a
>>>> >> statement that hardly could be proved anyway.
>>>> >> what about the african american, latino, immigrant, lgbt and women
>>>> >> vote--highly influential in this election not all of them predicated
>>>> >> on class per se, no?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> rich
>>>> >>
>>>> >> . But its effect on the election
>>>> >> > just passed could not be more profound, and it should not be ignored —
>>>> >> > though it likely will be — by the rest of the people trying to make
>>>> >> > sense of
>>>> >> > What It All Means. Occupy changed the national dialogue. Willard
>>>> >> > Romney's
>>>> >> > surreptitiously taped comments about "the 47 percent" would not have had
>>>> >> > the
>>>> >> > resonance they did had the Occupy movement not gotten the country
>>>> >> > talking
>>>> >> > about the 99 percent and the one percent. It created a new rhetorical
>>>> >> > paradigm that simply would not have been there had it not been
>>>> >> > originally
>>>> >> > shouted at the correct buildings. And it was that new paradigm that
>>>> >> > triumphed Tuesday night.
>>>> >
>>>> >
> 
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