Purely out of curiosity...

Sat Dec 12 00:10:29 CST 2015

I guess the only thing that stops a bad kid with a poorly constructed
clock is a good kid with a poorly constructed clock.

On Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 5:05 PM, Steven Koteff <steviekoteff at gmail.com> wrote:
> All your clarifications are noted, and important--I should've been
> carefuller about them in the first place.
>
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 12:02 AM, Mark Thibodeau <jerkyleboeuf at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> But that's kind of my point. Me and you paying attention to this is
>> meaningless. The MEDIA (95% of which is pushing a false narrative) are
>> the ones who should never have run with this. If they hadn't, then we
>> wouldn't be having to discuss it.
>>
>> And anyway, in the Big Picture, NOTHING really matters, does it? So
>> why even bring it up in this particular context?
>>
>> J.
>>
>> PS - Further clarification... I never claimed that the Mohammed family
>> planned any of this in advance, and I don't know anyone who does. The
>> opportunity simply presented itself, and they ran with it. No need for
>> any complicated conspiracy or plan. It's just that, as soon as the
>> media jumped on Ahmed's alleged "mistreatment", THAT's when the
>> conniving for money began. But that doesn't let Ahmed off the hook for
>> his shitty behavior.
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 12, 2015 at 12:48 AM, Steven Koteff <steviekoteff at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > I guess I'm curious also why this particular case is so exigent, if it
>> > is as
>> > simple as the kid and his father are con artists, or malicious
>> > provocateurs.
>> >
>> > If that's the case, then the wrongdoing is a relatively simple one, and
>> > committed on a relatively small scale (that is, by one or two people, as
>> > opposed to the broader/less addressable alternative that it's a systemic
>> > problem). People filing a ridiculous lawsuit--happens all the time.
>> >
>> > If that's the case, why does this particular one deserve more of my
>> > attention (which I'm giving it) than, say, climate talks, what Trump
>> > means
>> > for America, this Shkreli asshole, etc., all of which seem to be of more
>> > pressing concern to the country than just a single father and son acting
>> > wrongly and in a way that did not really physically endanger anyone. I
>> > mean
>> > I guess the fact that the case is so zeitgeisty sort of gives it its own
>> > exigence, right or wrong, and of course we should always be on the side
>> > of
>> > truth prevailing, but...
>> >
>> > I dunno. I'm not saying it's wrong to have the stance that the family
>> > should
>> > get nothing and should maybe be punished in some way. I do not even
>> > think
>> > the ends-justify-the-means thing (meaning that maybe the attention this
>> > gets
>> > helps lead us in the direction of more tolerance, of more peace, of less
>> > systemic prejudice and injustice, etc...) is a good counterargument if
>> > it
>> > depends on us accepting or ignoring something untrue--I do think the
>> > distinction should be made. But I guess I'm saying it feels like the
>> > swing
>> > in the other direction has been more than a return to rest or even an
>> > equal
>> > sort of pendulum-swing, but has been additional enmity and attention,
>> > also
>> > coming before all the facts are known, maybe.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:41 PM, Steven Koteff <steviekoteff at gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Do you think there is room for both parties to have somehow acted
>> >> wrongly?
>> >>
>> >> I.e. Ahmed and his father were being deliberately provocative (to the
>> >> end
>> >> of money and attention or whatever else) in Ahmed's bringing the clock
>> >> to
>> >> school and repeatedly calling attention to it,
>> >>
>> >> but also that the teachers and/or police (who as should be noted knew
>> >> Ahmed much better than we do) were, at some turn, possibly less
>> >> generous
>> >> than they could've been? Let's say Ahmed is routinely a pain in the ass
>> >> and
>> >> the source of small-scale mischief (that is, suspendable and outrageous
>> >> offenses but something short of taking lives) and possibly a bad kid,
>> >> like a
>> >> true-blue asshole. This seems true if he is guilty of deliberately
>> >> inciting
>> >> panic or whatever. (And if we can use the egregiousness of the lawsuit
>> >> to
>> >> retroactively inform our judgment of his character at time of
>> >> clock-display,
>> >> then we can also use keep going, by a sort of syllogism, to
>> >> retroactively
>> >> use it to assume that maybe he was just an obvious asshole from the
>> >> start.)
>> >>
>> >> If that's all true, then the teachers are possibly collectively sick of
>> >> his shit. Maybe one or several of them are having particularly rough
>> >> days
>> >> and so their patience is thin (this seems to be a fair possibility in
>> >> the
>> >> case of high school teachers who have to deal with dozens of students
>> >> like
>> >> Ahmed a day). And so maybe, despite having never actually thinking it
>> >> is
>> >> anything more dangerous than a clock that looks like an explosive
>> >> device,
>> >> they flex just a bit more bureaucratic muscle than they needed to.
>> >>
>> >> (We think that race/religion are the only things that can guide
>> >> decisions
>> >> like this, but in the case of a student and his school's faculty,
>> >> likely
>> >> their personal biases toward him are just as influential [though of
>> >> course
>> >> those are guided by any biases they might have toward his
>> >> race/religion,
>> >> etc.]).
>> >>
>> >> Maybe there are one or several points at which someone could've just
>> >> said,
>> >> "Ahmed, you're being an asshole, give me the clock, I'm putting it in
>> >> my
>> >> desk until the end of the day." But then, given the zero tolerance
>> >> thing,
>> >> there is a point at which this thing has too much momentum to just let
>> >> go...
>> >>
>> >> I don't know. I mean that sincerely--I really don't. I think the
>> >> account
>> >> of things you posted indicates that Ahmed and his father acted wrongly.
>> >> I
>> >> also think there is room in there for the teachers and police not just
>> >> to
>> >> have been victims but to have been sort of...punitively trigger-happy.
>> >> I say
>> >> this as someone who also went to junior high, and to high school, in
>> >> the
>> >> 21st century, in a Union state, and who witnessed open enmity from
>> >> teachers
>> >> toward particular students for reasons like: A) the kid is black, B)
>> >> the kid
>> >> is not smart, C) the kid is hyperactive, D) the teacher seems to have
>> >> an
>> >> unhappy disposition as is, E)tc.
>> >>
>> >> I think, as a society, we are not well equipped to deal with situations
>> >> this nuanced--in which multiple parties might have acted wrongly. Of
>> >> course
>> >> many such situations are probably like this to an extent. There are,
>> >> I'm
>> >> guessing, several minorities who were acting like assholes, possibly
>> >> very
>> >> high, being violent and unpredictable, making threats, handling (if not
>> >> using) weapons, who were killed by police officers, who might not have
>> >> been
>> >> killed had they been white.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:22 PM, Mark Thibodeau
>> >> <jerkyleboeuf at gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> >You've emphasized twice that the sources are 'mainstream.'
>> >>> >Why is that? To indicate that it is an unbiased take (as opposed
>> >>> >to a really political, say, blog) or to imply that it is more
>> >>> >stringently fact checked or...
>> >>>
>> >>> I mention it because, as someone who was "internet famous" between
>> >>> 1999 and 2006 (peak years 2000-2003) as sole author and content
>> >>> provider of a quite successful proto-blog email newsletter (The Daily
>> >>> Dirt), I am intimately aware of and particularly sensitive to the
>> >>> (ahem) "liberties" taken by the reactionary right-wing side of the
>> >>> blog-and-comment-o-sphere. I spent much of my seven years as Jerky
>> >>> LeBoeuf (coinciding as they did with the Dubya preznitcy) debunking
>> >>> and fact-checking the likes of Drudge Report, Fox News, Rush Limbaugh,
>> >>> Free Republic, Little Green Footballs, and all the rest of the
>> >>> then-nascent ultra-conservative first-gen blog-rolls. So I would hate
>> >>> to be mistaken as one of those. On the other hand, I am currently on
>> >>> the edge of despair due to so many of my former friends, readers and
>> >>> other allies behaving as left-leaning versions of the assholes I
>> >>> mention above, ever ready to assume the worst of any institution (or
>> >>> cis-gendered white male), accept any and all claims to victimhood as
>> >>> valid, and basically display the same kind of ravening, drool-flecked
>> >>> howling, pack mentality, as if they've torn a page from the main
>> >>> stylebook of the turn-of-the-millennium Conservative Movementarians.
>> >>>
>> >>> >It's hard, in something this complicated, to rely on second-
>> >>> >(and third-, and...)hand reportage. When everyone involved
>> >>> >has so much at stake now (even if the teachers acted 100%
>> >>> >rightly, they're now in a situation where they are probably
>> >>> >compelled to act and testify in their own self-interest, just for
>> >>> > protection).
>> >>>
>> >>> Yes. And that's why I always try to reason these things out for
>> >>> myself, with as cool a head as humanly possible. In this case, for
>> >>> instance, I asked myself, would it be REASONABLE for a teacher to
>> >>> believe that someone who brought such a thing into class was up to
>> >>> some kind of mischief? As soon as I saw the "clock" in question... it
>> >>> was clear to me that, OF COURSE the teachers were right to be
>> >>> suspicious. The thing could not possibly look less like a clock. The
>> >>> only way it could look more like a cliche'd action movie bomb was if
>> >>> it was a bowling ball with a firecracker sticking out of the top. So,
>> >>> next step for me, if the teachers were correct in SUSPECTING POSSIBLE
>> >>> BAD INTENT, then were they right to call in the police? It turns out,
>> >>> considering the school district's zero tolerance policy, they probably
>> >>> didn't even have a choice. Same as if they'd caught him with booze, or
>> >>> a joint, or if he'd pinched a female student's bottom and she'd
>> >>> complained... the authorities HAD TO BE called in. And they were. Now,
>> >>> that leads us to the question of whether the authorities did anything
>> >>> wrong by taking Ahmed into custody, or putting him in handcuffs, or
>> >>> keeping him from his parents for an hour and a half. And you know
>> >>> what? There is NO legislation that prevents police from detaining or
>> >>> handcuffing a 14 year old. This should be patently obvious to anyone
>> >>> who went through junior high school (as it was to me, as I myself have
>> >>> personally witnessed teacher and police behavior towards 13/14/15 year
>> >>> olds that was FAR more egregious and unjust than what poor Ahmed went
>> >>> through). But apparently most of the members of the media who have
>> >>> been reporting on this story were hot-house flowers who grew up in
>> >>> social justice enclaves where they were taught (hahaha) that life
>> >>> should be "fair" or something, or that if you have a problem with
>> >>> authority, you can always sue the bastards. Well, maybe that's true. I
>> >>> certainly hope it isn't, because for the Muhammed family to get one
>> >>> thin dime out of this would be a travesty of justice and a blow
>> >>> against common sense, in my opinion as an anti-racist, anti-fascist,
>> >>> authority-skeptic liberal of long standing.
>> >>>
>> >>> Sincerely;
>> >>> J
>> >>>
>> >>> On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:52 PM, Steven Koteff
>> >>> <steviekoteff at gmail.com>
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> > I don't mean to imply anything. Just thanking you for doing the
>> >>> > research--I
>> >>> > am in that gray area of being curious enough to want to know the
>> >>> > timeline
>> >>> > without being curious enough (or having enough time) to do much
>> >>> > digging
>> >>> > myself.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > And also, because you seem much more up on this than I am, I am
>> >>> > curious
>> >>> > to
>> >>> > hear your takeaway.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > I think if everything in that article is right then it kind of seems
>> >>> > like it
>> >>> > was at best incredibly ignorant and irresponsible on the part of the
>> >>> > dad and
>> >>> > the son. At worst (and the direction it seems to lean, if the
>> >>> > article
>> >>> > is
>> >>> > right) possibly a deliberately provocative act on the part of the
>> >>> > father. To
>> >>> > what end? Is it just about money and attention? I actually think, if
>> >>> > the
>> >>> > provocation is deliberate, it betrays not just run-of-the-mill
>> >>> > selfish
>> >>> > motives but also personal disturbance on the part of the father, and
>> >>> > the kid
>> >>> > too.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > But all that comes with the caveat that the account is true. You've
>> >>> > emphasized twice that the sources are 'mainstream.' Why is that? To
>> >>> > indicate
>> >>> > that it is an unbiased take (as opposed to a really political, say,
>> >>> > blog) or
>> >>> > to imply that it is more stringently fact checked or...
>> >>> >
>> >>> > It's hard, in something this complicated, to rely on second-(and
>> >>> > third-,
>> >>> > and...)hand reportage. When everyone involved has so much at stake
>> >>> > now
>> >>> > (even
>> >>> > if the teachers acted 100% rightly, they're now in a situation where
>> >>> > they
>> >>> > are probably compelled to act and testify in their own
>> >>> > self-interest,
>> >>> > just
>> >>> > for protection).
>> >>> >
>> >>> > I read that article saying that the police said something, but at
>> >>> > least
>> >>> > half
>> >>> > of me is thinking I should be asking, "But who says the police said
>> >>> > that?"
>> >>> >
>> >>> > On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:38 PM, Mark Thibodeau
>> >>> > <jerkyleboeuf at gmail.com>
>> >>> > wrote:
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Here's a handy timeline from the ArtVoice blog. The facts all check
>> >>> >> out (meaning the author hasn't misrepresented the mostly mainstream
>> >>> >> articles to which he refers):
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> On the morning of Sept 14, Mohamed El Hassan Mohamed drove his son
>> >>> >> Ahmed to school and at that time, according to NBC Dallas/Ft.Worth,
>> >>> >> Mohamed "encouraged him to demonstrate his gift of technology" at
>> >>> >> the
>> >>> >> school. He was referring to a small plain metal case, inside of
>> >>> >> which
>> >>> >> contained the hastily arranged and unshielded electronic components
>> >>> >> of
>> >>> >> a 1980's Micronta digital alarm clock. A device Ahmed would
>> >>> >> repeatedly
>> >>> >> insist he threw together the night before in just 15 minutes from
>> >>> >> of
>> >>> >> "scraps" laying around his house, a device that he himself
>> >>> >> considered
>> >>> >> to appear suspicious and threatening.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Defying common sense, it appears that Mohamed, the man who runs the
>> >>> >> National Reform Party of Sudan, who is considered an enlightened
>> >>> >> scholar in Sudan, who ran for its presidency twice in the last 5
>> >>> >> years, whose daughter was suspended from school for a bomb threat,
>> >>> >> whose son was detained and suspended for multiple disciplinary
>> >>> >> problems and electronic pranks, in a town recently rocked by a
>> >>> >> double
>> >>> >> murder honor killing and lies 25 minutes from the Garland TX Jihadi
>> >>> >> attack, on the first day back to school after the anniversary of
>> >>> >> 9-11,
>> >>> >> encourages his son to bring in a nondescript metal case with a
>> >>> >> timer
>> >>> >> and loose wiring inside without being asked to by any teacher, a
>> >>> >> device even his son admits looked threatening and suspicious.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Next we are told by Ahmed that he shows the device to his 1st
>> >>> >> period
>> >>> >> Science teacher who sensitively and politely tells him the device
>> >>> >> is
>> >>> >> "nice" but it looks like a bomb and so he should put it away and
>> >>> >> not
>> >>> >> take it out and show it to anyone else at school.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> According to Mark Cuban who spoke with an Irving resident who's
>> >>> >> friend
>> >>> >> is a teacher in Mac Arthur H.S., Ahmed proceeded to show off the
>> >>> >> device to each teacher all the way to 6th period where in English
>> >>> >> class, Ahmed claims to have plugged the device into the wall outlet
>> >>> >> and set the alarm to go off in the middle of class "to show a
>> >>> >> friend".
>> >>> >> When the teacher reacted to the disruption he "unplugged it right
>> >>> >> away". After showing the English teacher what caused the
>> >>> >> disruption,
>> >>> >> the teacher told him it looks like a bomb, that it is making her
>> >>> >> nervous and would make others nervous, and to put it away in his
>> >>> >> backpack, to which Ahmed said "I don't think it looks like a bomb".
>> >>> >> At
>> >>> >> the end of class the device was confiscated and the Principal
>> >>> >> alerted.
>> >>> >> The Irving school system adheres to a zero tolerance policy
>> >>> >> regarding
>> >>> >> threatening devices, and being that the possession of such a device
>> >>> >> with intent to alarm others is a criminal offense in Texas, the
>> >>> >> police
>> >>> >> were called to question Ahmed and determine what his intentions
>> >>> >> were.
>> >>> >> Later 3 teachers would sign a complaint to the police about a hoax
>> >>> >> bomb, as the Principal decided to contact the police on the issue.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> The police arrived at school and entered the conference room where
>> >>> >> Ahmed was detained and one officer claimed "that is who I thought
>> >>> >> it
>> >>> >> was". Likely referring to Ahmed's past troubles and his family's
>> >>> >> notoriety. The police questioned Ahmed, and claimed he was not
>> >>> >> forthcoming, passive aggressive, and would not directly answer
>> >>> >> their
>> >>> >> questions. They decided to arrest him for possession of a hoax bomb
>> >>> >> and bring him to the police station where they would continue their
>> >>> >> investigation to determine whether he intended to raise alarm with
>> >>> >> his
>> >>> >> device, a Class A misdemeanor.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Somehow or other it appears Ahmed's 18 year old sister Eyman found
>> >>> >> out
>> >>> >> that Ahmed was being taken to the police station. There is an
>> >>> >> iconic
>> >>> >> photo of Ahmed in handcuffs taken by Eyman, and some captions under
>> >>> >> that photo indicate it was taken at the police station. This
>> >>> >> implies
>> >>> >> his sister arrived shortly after Ahmed arrived, because he would
>> >>> >> not
>> >>> >> have been in handcuffs after he was released without charge an hour
>> >>> >> later. There is also speculation Eyman took the photo as Ahmed was
>> >>> >> leaving the school in handcuffs.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Ahmed's father claims the first he heard of his son's problem was
>> >>> >> from
>> >>> >> a phone call from the police. We do not know if he arrived with or
>> >>> >> separate from Eyman. It is hard to believe Eyman heard about the
>> >>> >> incident and arrived at the police station to take that photo and
>> >>> >> never alerted her father. If Eyman only knew through her father,
>> >>> >> this
>> >>> >> would mean they both arrived at the station in time to see Ahmed
>> >>> >> before he went in a private room for questioning. Improbable but
>> >>> >> possible. The father's account follows.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> **The first he heard of it was when he received a call from police,
>> >>> >> who said his son was being charged with having a hoax bomb, Mohamed
>> >>> >> said.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> He rushed to the police station, where he saw his son "surrounded
>> >>> >> by
>> >>> >> five police and he was handcuffed," the father said. Ahmed told his
>> >>> >> father he'd asked to phone him but the police told him he could not
>> >>> >> because he was under arrest, Mohamed said.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> "I asked if I could talk to or speak to my son and they told me,
>> >>> >> 'No,
>> >>> >> not right now' because they were taking his fingerprints and asking
>> >>> >> him questions," Mohamed said. "I asked if I could see the thing
>> >>> >> they
>> >>> >> were calling a bomb. The police never let me even see it but I knew
>> >>> >> what my son brought to school. It was an alarm clock that he made.
>> >>> >> He
>> >>> >> wakes up with it most mornings. **
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Here we have Mohamed contradicting his son's claim the device was
>> >>> >> hastily thrown together the night before. His credibility as a
>> >>> >> responsible parent and supervisor of his child already strained to
>> >>> >> the
>> >>> >> limit, he goes on to claim, "my son was hurt and tortured and
>> >>> >> arrested
>> >>> >> and mistreated in front of his friends at school".
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> After further questioning, the police could not find anything in
>> >>> >> Ahmed's statements to indicate he intended to cause alarm, and
>> >>> >> released him without charge.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> The family went on to set off a social media firestorm portraying
>> >>> >> Ahmed as persecuted and harassed, "hurt and tortured" by
>> >>> >> Islamophobic
>> >>> >> xenophobic, vindictive officials from the school and police
>> >>> >> station,
>> >>> >> holding press conferences where suddenly their son was able to
>> >>> >> speak
>> >>> >> in great detail about the incident, as opposed to the "name rank
>> >>> >> and
>> >>> >> serial number" routine he gave the police.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> There was never a moment where Mohamed El Hassan expressed even a
>> >>> >> small fraction of responsibility as the parent the person at the
>> >>> >> center of this incident. No apology or humility, only strident
>> >>> >> arrogant and slanderous accusations issued from him. Even today as
>> >>> >> Ahmed has been seen laughing, joking, and smiling all across the
>> >>> >> USA
>> >>> >> as he visits dozens of august institutions and famous talk shows
>> >>> >> that
>> >>> >> roll out the red carpet for the self proclaimed "inventor of a
>> >>> >> clock",
>> >>> >> his family insists Ahmed is "severely traumatized" and "lacking
>> >>> >> appetite and ability to sleep". Furthermore Mohamed refused to
>> >>> >> accept
>> >>> >> the police repeated offer to come pick up the device, while hiring
>> >>> >> lawyers to sue the police, in part, for refusing to release the
>> >>> >> device
>> >>> >> to the family. The family has refused to sign a waiver allowing the
>> >>> >> school and police from telling their side of the story to the
>> >>> >> media,
>> >>> >> while they continue to offer a contradictory version that evolves
>> >>> >> daily, along side baseless and slanderous accusations against
>> >>> >> officials.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> According to Ahmed's own words, his authority figure (Science
>> >>> >> teacher)
>> >>> >> confirmed Ahmed's own perception and told him his device looked
>> >>> >> like a
>> >>> >> bomb and not to show it to anyone. Ahmed then set the alarm on the
>> >>> >> device in the middle of class. He appears to have had the intent to
>> >>> >> evoke some reaction. His actions were reckless, and arguably
>> >>> >> criminal.
>> >>> >> Yet the media continues to portray him as a persecuted victim, even
>> >>> >> as
>> >>> >> he and his family stood in NYC with the Mayor who proclaimed
>> >>> >> 9/29/2015
>> >>> >> as "Ahmed day", before flying to the Middle East where they met
>> >>> >> with
>> >>> >> various community and political leaders (including more than one
>> >>> >> with
>> >>> >> a history of conducting large-scale massacres of non-combatants).
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:34 PM, Mark Thibodeau
>> >>> >> <jerkyleboeuf at gmail.com>
>> >>> >> wrote:
>> >>> >> > And for those of you who are wondering "Where on Earth did he
>> >>> >> > ever
>> >>> >> > ADMIT
>> >>> >> > that his creation might look SUSPICIOUS or LIKE A THREAT, Mister
>> >>> >> > Smarty
>> >>> >> > Pants?!", kindly jump to the 1 minute, 30 second point on this
>> >>> >> > video
>> >>> >> > to
>> >>> >> > see
>> >>> >> > where he basically admits that he knew the thing would probably
>> >>> >> > freak
>> >>> >> > people
>> >>> >> > out.
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bGeBk8Fus0
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 11:30 PM, Mark Thibodeau
>> >>> >> > <jerkyleboeuf at gmail.com>
>> >>> >> > wrote:
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >> I think a more pertinent question might be, please cite where
>> >>> >> >> it's
>> >>> >> >> illegal
>> >>> >> >> for police to detain and question 14 year olds.
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >> The teachers followed the rules, and the people who best know
>> >>> >> >> this
>> >>> >> >> kid
>> >>> >> >> --
>> >>> >> >> the teachers who work with him on a daily basis (you know...
>> >>> >> >> teachers?
>> >>> >> >> those
>> >>> >> >> underpaid heroes we love so much? the same people some of you
>> >>> >> >> are
>> >>> >> >> now
>> >>> >> >> willing to throw under the bus because it suits your OMGRACISM
>> >>> >> >> worldview?)
>> >>> >> >> thought his behavior merited action.
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >> Before I bring you guys the most complete narrative I can put
>> >>> >> >> together
>> >>> >> >> of
>> >>> >> >> what happened (based on mainstream news sources), HERE is a
>> >>> >> >> video
>> >>> >> >> showing
>> >>> >> >> what it took to "invent" the clock that he "invented"
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIzQjS6tn4w
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >> On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 3:45 PM, <rbollinger at austin.rr.com>
>> >>> >> >> wrote:
>> >>> >> >>>
>> >>> >> >>> Please cite your statute governing reassembled clock parts...
>> >>> >> >>>
>> >>> >> >>>
>> >>> >> >>> Rob Bollinger
>> >>> >> >>> Austin TX
>> >>> >> >>>
>> >>> >> >>> ---- ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> >> >>> > Was the clock a school project? In other words, did a
>> >>> >> >>> > teacher, a
>> >>> >> >>> > club
>> >>> >> >>> > adviser, any adult in the school assign a project, and did
>> >>> >> >>> > the
>> >>> >> >>> > clock
>> >>> >> >>> > fit
>> >>> >> >>> > the assignment? Or did the young man make a clock and bring
>> >>> >> >>> > it
>> >>> >> >>> > to
>> >>> >> >>> > school?
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> > As far as I can tell the young man did not build a clock or
>> >>> >> >>> > make
>> >>> >> >>> > a
>> >>> >> >>> > project,
>> >>> >> >>> > or in any way bring something to school that was part of an
>> >>> >> >>> > assignment
>> >>> >> >>> > from
>> >>> >> >>> > any adult in the building. It was not a project. It was not
>> >>> >> >>> > show
>> >>> >> >>> > and
>> >>> >> >>> > tell.
>> >>> >> >>> > It seems the student took apart a clock, re-fashioned it and
>> >>> >> >>> > put
>> >>> >> >>> > in
>> >>> >> >>> > in
>> >>> >> >>> > a
>> >>> >> >>> > box and brought it to school.
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> > Why did he do this? What was his motivation?
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> > Whatever his intentions, if he re-assembled clock parts in a
>> >>> >> >>> > box
>> >>> >> >>> > and
>> >>> >> >>> > took
>> >>> >> >>> > them to school, he broke the law. While 14 year old boys, and
>> >>> >> >>> > sometimes
>> >>> >> >>> > 14
>> >>> >> >>> > year old girls, are instructed that bringing a clock in a
>> >>> >> >>> > box, a
>> >>> >> >>> > plastic
>> >>> >> >>> > gun, a plastic sword, a paper bomb or dynamite  etc..., even
>> >>> >> >>> > on
>> >>> >> >>> > Halloween
>> >>> >> >>> > is dangerous and against the law, young people do make these
>> >>> >> >>> > kinds
>> >>> >> >>> > of
>> >>> >> >>> > mistakes, from time to time. Best if they make them in school
>> >>> >> >>> > as
>> >>> >> >>> > school
>> >>> >> >>> > is
>> >>> >> >>> > the safest place in the world for students. Obviously, doing
>> >>> >> >>> > so
>> >>> >> >>> > in
>> >>> >> >>> > the
>> >>> >> >>> > street may get one killed by a police officer or even a gun
>> >>> >> >>> > toting
>> >>> >> >>> > citizen.
>> >>> >> >>> > In a school the child, age 14, will be interrogated,
>> >>> >> >>> > handcuffed,
>> >>> >> >>> > probably,
>> >>> >> >>> > and asked to write a statement explaining his or her
>> >>> >> >>> > intentions
>> >>> >> >>> > and
>> >>> >> >>> > the
>> >>> >> >>> > police will contact the guardians and book the kid. This is
>> >>> >> >>> > the
>> >>> >> >>> > law.
>> >>> >> >>> > It
>> >>> >> >>> > matters not the race or religion of the child.
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> > From time to time, a  brave administrator, more likely an
>> >>> >> >>> > experienced
>> >>> >> >>> > teacher will protect the child with a slap on the wrist, but
>> >>> >> >>> > the
>> >>> >> >>> > current
>> >>> >> >>> > mood in the country and in schools is making this a rare act
>> >>> >> >>> > of....welll
>> >>> >> >>> > not courage, but decency.
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> > On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 9:02 AM, The Jonathon Hunt Experience
>> >>> >> >>> > <
>> >>> >> >>> > newtalkingwall at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> >> >>> >
>> >>> >> >>> > > Is there any evidence that the kid "only" took apart a
>> >>> >> >>> > > store
>> >>> >> >>> > > bought
>> >>> >> >>> > > clock
>> >>> >> >>> > > and put it back together, beyond people online pointing out
>> >>> >> >>> > > that
>> >>> >> >>> > > doing so
>> >>> >> >>> > > is a thing that people can do? Beyond that, if the child
>> >>> >> >>> > > acted
>> >>> >> >>> > > as
>> >>> >> >>> > > maliciously as Richard Dawkins and others would like to
>> >>> >> >>> > > believe,
>> >>> >> >>> > > this
>> >>> >> >>> > > means
>> >>> >> >>> > > his whole plan hinged on the knowledge that his teachers
>> >>> >> >>> > > and
>> >>> >> >>> > > police
>> >>> >> >>> > > would
>> >>> >> >>> > > confuse a circuit board and some wires with something that
>> >>> >> >>> > > can
>> >>> >> >>> > > explode. If
>> >>> >> >>> > > our teachers and police are this stupid (which seems to be
>> >>> >> >>> > > the
>> >>> >> >>> > > case,
>> >>> >> >>> > > here),
>> >>> >> >>> > > then we are lucky in getting off with a $15 million dollar
>> >>> >> >>> > > fine.
>> >>> >> >>> > >
>> >>> >> >>>
>> >>> >> >>> -
>> >>> >> >>> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >>
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> -
>> >>> >> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>
>
-
Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list=pynchon-l