GR translation: patches will flash up now and then

[Mike Jing]

That did help a lot.  Thank you both.

Mike

On Sat, Sep 5, 2015 at 10:29 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:

> And the impossible is Is why we seek to help Mike.
>
>
> On Saturday, September 5, 2015, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Yes. But the impossible is always the challenge.
>>
>> On Saturday, September 5, 2015, Dave Monroe <against.the.dave at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Quitters never win.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Sep 5, 2015 at 9:19 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > Understanding anything is impossible.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Saturday, September 5, 2015, Dave Monroe <
>>> against.the.dave at gmail.com>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Des tours de Babel
>>> >>
>>> >> "What the multiplicity of idioms comes to limit is not only a 'true'
>>> >> translation, a transparent and adequate interexpression, it is also a
>>> >> structural order, a coherence of construct...."
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> http://users.clas.ufl.edu/burt/deconstructionandnewmediatheory/destourdebabel.pdf
>>> >>
>>> >> On Sat, Sep 5, 2015 at 9:08 PM, Dave Monroe <
>>> against.the.dave at gmail.com>
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >> > The Task of the Translator
>>> >> >
>>> >> > "... any translation that intends to perform a transmitting function
>>> >> > cannot transmit anything but communica- tion-hence, something
>>> >> > inessential. This is the hallmark of bad translations. But do we not
>>> >> > generally regard that which lies beyond communication in a literary
>>> >> > work-and even a poor translator will admit that this is its
>>> essential
>>> >> > substance-as the unfathomable, the mysterious, the 'poetic'? And is
>>> >> > this not something that a translator can reproduce only if he is
>>> >> > also--a poet? Such, actually, is the cause of another characteristic
>>> >> > of inferior translation, which consequently we may define as the
>>> >> > inaccurate transmission of an inessential content. Whenever a
>>> >> > translation undertakes to serve the reader, it demonstrates this.
>>> >> > However, if it were intended for the reader, the same would have to
>>> >> > apply to the original. If the original does not exist for the
>>> reader's
>>> >> > sake, how could the translation be understood on the basis of this
>>> >> > premise?
>>> >> >    "Translation is a form. To comprehend it as a form, one must go
>>> >> > back to the original, for the laws governing the translation lie
>>> >> > within the original, contained in the issue of its
>>> >> > translatability...."
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> http://users.clas.ufl.edu/burt/deconstructionandnewmediatheory/walterbenjamintasktranslator.pdf
>>> >> >
>>> >> > On Sat, Sep 5, 2015 at 9:01 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> >> >> Yes, but that threshold is too high for normal world translators.
>>> Real
>>> >> >> translation of poetry is impossible. The reader must become the
>>> learned
>>> >> >> translator, eventually.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> On Saturday, September 5, 2015, Dave Monroe
>>> >> >> <against.the.dave at gmail.com>
>>> >> >> wrote:
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>> ... too many resonances to catch to translate "literally" (see,
>>> e.g.,
>>> >> >>> my earlier notes on hysteron proteron in GR).  You're not just
>>> >> >>> translating words, you're translating relationships ...
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>> On Sat, Sep 5, 2015 at 8:33 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >> >>> wrote:
>>> >> >>> > I think Mike's translation challenge with Pynchon is in NOT
>>> >> >>> > interpreting
>>> >> >>> > the
>>> >> >>> > text. Be literal, because poetry should be translated prior to
>>> >> >>> > interpretation.
>>> >> >>> >
>>> >> >>> > David Morris
>>> >> >>> >
>>> >> >>> > On Saturday, September 5, 2015, David Morris <
>>> fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >> >>> > wrote:
>>> >> >>> >>
>>> >> >>> >> Getting specific, patches flashing up on the visible
>>> mountainsides
>>> >> >>> >> resembles a divisional patch.  That association is the point.
>>> But
>>> >> >>> >> it
>>> >> >>> >> shouldn't be explicit in translation. Indeed it can't be
>>> >> >>> >> translated.
>>> >> >>> >>
>>> >> >>> >> David Morris
>>> >> >>> >>
>>> >> >>> >> On Saturday, September 5, 2015, David Morris <
>>> fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>> >> >>> >> wrote:
>>> >> >>> >>>
>>> >> >>> >>> This passage is trying to relate a drug induced experience,
>>> and
>>> >> >>> >>> thus
>>> >> >>> >>> is
>>> >> >>> >>> impossible to translate into a normal experience, except by
>>> >> >>> >>> extreme
>>> >> >>> >>> analogies, which is what Pynchon so often does. So throw out
>>> >> >>> >>> normal
>>> >> >>> >>> analogies.
>>> >> >>> >>>
>>> >> >>> >>> In extreme drug-induced experience, "patches" of perception
>>> will
>>> >> >>> >>> flash
>>> >> >>> >>> brightly. Messages from the paranoid beyond, which might, or
>>> might
>>> >> >>> >>> not, be
>>> >> >>> >>> crucial to survival. And which you might forget having
>>> received in
>>> >> >>> >>> the
>>> >> >>> >>> next
>>> >> >>> >>> second.
>>> >> >>> >>>
>>> >> >>> >>> David Morris
>>> >> >>> >>>
>>> >> >>> >>> On Saturday, September 5, 2015, Mike Jing
>>> >> >>> >>> <gravitys.rainbow.cn at gmail.com>
>>> >> >>> >>> wrote:
>>> >> >>> >>>>
>>> >> >>> >>>> V640.30-641.2   On the mountainsides, patches will flash up
>>> now
>>> >> >>> >>>> and
>>> >> >>> >>>> then, bright as dittany in July at the Zippo’s ceremonial
>>> touch.
>>> >> >>> >>>> Pfc.
>>> >> >>> >>>> Eddie
>>> >> >>> >>>> Pensiero, a replacement here in the 89th Division, also an
>>> >> >>> >>>> amphetamine
>>> >> >>> >>>> enthusiast, sits huddling nearly on top of the fire,
>>> shivering
>>> >> >>> >>>> and
>>> >> >>> >>>> watching
>>> >> >>> >>>> the divisional patch on his arm, which ordinarily resembles a
>>> >> >>> >>>> cluster
>>> >> >>> >>>> of
>>> >> >>> >>>> rocketnoses seen out of a dilating asshole, all in black and
>>> >> >>> >>>> olive-drab, but
>>> >> >>> >>>> which now looks like something even stranger than that, which
>>> >> >>> >>>> Eddie
>>> >> >>> >>>> will
>>> >> >>> >>>> think of in a minute.
>>> >> >>> >>>>
>>> >> >>> >>>> Are these patches of vegetation, or something else entirely?
>>>
>>
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