BtZ42 this section

[Monte Davis]

Gotta love the duplicity of Winnetou as hero along with extermination /
displacement / subjugation for his kind.

I'm reminded of The Dying Gaul/ Galatian, one of the best-known and most
reproduced statues among both imperial Romans and modern classicists. It
was the perfect twofer Look how noble and admirable he is... almost a shame
that we defeated him, eh?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dying_Gaul

On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 10:50 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:

> He was...it sez right here in wikipedia....AS WERE SO MANY in Germany!...
> He was the Dan Brown of the Germany of his time; he was bigger than
> Rowling's Harry Potter. (I'm guessing)....
>
> Pace Shelley. Poets aren't the unacknowledged legislators of their time;
> popular novelists were.
>
> On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 10:38 AM, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Yep. Bloodlands makes GR feel like a lighthearted romp.
>>
>> Bringing it back via Crutchfield and Whappo... Snyder writes:
>>
>> "The East was the Nazi Manifest Destiny. In Hitler's view, 'in the East a
>> similar process will repeat itself a second time as in the conquest of
>> America.'  As Hitler imagined the future, Germany would deal with the Slavs
>> much as the North Americans had dealt with the Indians. The Volga River in
>> Russia, he once proclaimed, will be Germany's Mississippi."
>>
>> I wonder if he was a Karl May fan?
>>
>> <http://goog_402371410>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_May
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 10:10 AM, rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> beyond that I think a bigger problem if you want to call it that for
>>> Stalin was collaboration with the Nazis in the occupied territories--if you
>>> highlight the murder of jews then you highlight all the non-German
>>> accomplices, some of which changed sides wily nily, partly for survival,
>>> partly for more cynical reasons. Poland, Ukraine, Lithuania, Belarus to a
>>> lesser extent to this day is only coming to terms; we know how the French
>>> feel as it has been a national hovering ghost since the end of the war.
>>>
>>> rich
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jun 20, 2016 at 12:26 PM, Monte Davis <montedavis49 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> There certainly was some "post-war communist suppression of Jewish
>>>> deaths" in the USSR, although I'd call it "downplaying" rather than
>>>> suppression. And that certainly did have roots in (1) homegrown anti-Jewish
>>>> prejudice in Russia and much of Eastern Europe -- the "pale" and recurring
>>>> pogroms back to medieval times -- and (2) the USSR's ideological discomfort
>>>> with any ethnic/cultural identity that might compete with the nominal
>>>> internationalist "workers of the world," or the de facto dominance of the
>>>> Russian majority.
>>>>
>>>> But to give the devil his due, you know from Snyder that the Nazis'
>>>> Generalplan Ost coolly envisioned for *after* their victory the systematic
>>>> death of >30 million in the USSR, and the deportation farther east of as
>>>> many or more -- not to mention the ~25 million civilians and soldiers they
>>>> actually killed in the course of the war.
>>>>
>>>> I have to say that if, as a citizen of the USSR -- or just a Slav --
>>>> I'd been part of that target population, the specifically Jewish aspect of
>>>> the Holocaust would not loom as large or seem as central to Nazi
>>>> murderousness as it does from the West.
>>>>
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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