NP - It Was the Racism (not economics)

Fri Nov 24 09:50:34 CST 2017

You make a lot of embarrassing assumptions :( 

Or they should be embarrassing. Assuming skin color & assuming inner thoughts based on skin color is... well it should be below you, us, &c &c. 

Interesting to pass as "white man". I don't want to know.

> On Nov 24, 2017, at 10:09 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> What you mean by "we," white man?
> 
>> On Thu, Nov 23, 2017 at 9:51 PM Atticus Pinecone <atticuspinecone at gmail.com> wrote:
>> As Pynchon people we should know better. Blacks, whites, yellows, let's skip the sweeping conclusions please.
>> 
>> > On Nov 23, 2017, at 10:38 PM, L E Bryan <lebryan at sonic.net> wrote:
>> >
>> > It seems to me that talking about “blacks” as a whole is more and more like discussing “blue-eyed”. Aside from the hue, what more can be said about the entire group?
>> >
>> > Lawrence
>> >
>> >> On Nov 23, 2017, at 3:12 PM, Becky Lindroos <bekah0176 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> And a lot of it is over-simplification and sometimes stereotyping.   There are huge blocks of blacks and Latinos who vote with the evangelical and Catholic churches against abortion and LGBT issues and so on.   Blacks are also anti-immigration because they fear it’s about their jobs, too.  Latinos tend toward small business ideas in the southwest - another Trump agenda item.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Becky
>> >> https://beckylindroos.wordpress.com
>> >>
>> >>> On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:32 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Both is an excuse, not analysis.  If "economic anxiety" is one of "both," it was leveraged into racial anxiety.  And racial anxiety spans all economic classes. Economic fears are real. Racial fears are tools for exploitation.
>> >>>
>> >>> David Morris
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thu, Nov 23, 2017 at 12:48 PM da kid <peterock86 at live.com> wrote:
>> >>> It was both. End of story. People getting screwed by the economy and being lied to, convincing them that it's China, illegal s, and blacks. Sad how the country is being balkanized.
>> >>> From: owner-pynchon-l at waste.org <owner-pynchon-l at waste.org> on behalf of David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2017 12:00:05 AM
>> >>> To: Robert Mahnke
>> >>> Cc: Atticus Pinecone; Chris v; Paul Mackin; pynchon -l
>> >>> Subject: Re: NP - It Was the Racism (not economics)
>> >>>
>> >>> Trump running against Obama was never an overt message, but all other racism was cool.  Trump was so dissed by Obama at that Press Dinner that Trump later became a cartoon car bomb on our democracy.  BLAMB! Then all laughs, on us.
>> >>>
>> >>> Cool.  But,  "Look further than race"  shouldn't mean discount it.  It's always a gumbo, but Trump made racism front and central in that mix.
>> >>>
>> >>> David Morris
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 10:30 PM Robert Mahnke <rpmahnke at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> I guess one thought I have about that article in the context of this thread is that while it captures something important about Trump and his support, to me it doesn't do a good job explaining the election. Trump wasn't really running against Obama, who was still popular enough that I think he would have beat Trump easily in a head-to-head race. If you want to explain Trump's success in getting elected, I think you have to look farther than race.
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 8:24 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> I loved that article!  Our white press has a really hard time calling out white racism.
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 10:16 PM Robert Mahnke <rpmahnke at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> This piece by Adam Serwer is worthy of your time, and not unrelated to what we're talking about:
>> >>>
>> >>> https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/11/the-nationalists-delusion/546356/
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 7:56 PM, Chris v <traditionalgb at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> I assumed you were intelligent enough to make the inference
>> >>>
>> >>> On 20 Nov 2017 9:40 pm, "David Morris" <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> Too many links w no synopsis or click bait headlines.  Give a little more effort if you expect a response.
>> >>> My unsolicited advice.
>> >>>
>> >>> David Morris
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 9:26 PM Chris v <traditionalgb at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> It hurts cuz I like mother jones, but come on.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> https://www.forbes.com/sites/aviksaroy/2016/11/19/man-bites-dog-trump-did-better-with-minorities-than-mitt-romney-did-in-2012/
>> >>>
>> >>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2016/11/11/trump-got-more-votes-from-people-of-color-than-romney-did-heres-the-data/
>> >>>
>> >>> https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/2016-election-day/trump-did-better-blacks-hispanics-romney-12-exit-polls-n681386
>> >>>
>> >>> http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/11/09/behind-trumps-victory-divisions-by-race-gender-education/
>> >>>
>> >>> On 20 Nov 2017 6:43 pm, "David Morris" <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> Esdall:
>> >>>
>> >>> In some respects, the data gathered by Orfield’s team is good news for Democrats. The core of Trump’s support lies in counties and municipalities like Dravosburg and Elk County, many of which are losing population. They are, in effect, the last gasp of white hegemony.
>> >>> [...]
>> >>> what is really striking is how much influence over the course of events was exercised by the relatively small numbers of voters in super-white municipalities and counties and by the politician who ignited them — how the last gasp of a small fraction of the electorate set the nation on such a dangerous and destructive course.
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 6:17 PM Robert Mahnke <rpmahnke at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> At the risk of stating the obvious, Romney got 47.2% of the vote and Trump got only 46.1%. (Numbers per Wikipedia, which never makes mistakes.) So if one is trying to look for reasons that Trump won, looking at where he outperformed Romney doesn't quite go to the question, although it's not a worthless inquiry. Where Trump really outperformed was in the Electoral College.
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 3:49 PM, Paul Mackin <mackin.paul at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> MJ's piece was entirely based on the Thomas B. Esdall piece, which was a prime example of what-put-Trump-over-the-top-ism.
>> >>>
>> >>> A lot of things put Trump over the top.
>> >>>
>> >>> Socking it to the Elite is my favorite.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 5:44 PM, Atticus Pinecone <atticuspinecone at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> Right, what's the link there? White people feel that way? There's no poll. Seems like a bit of a leap.
>> >>>
>> >>> And NPR told me it was dumb poor white people voting for Trump...
>> >>>
>> >>> I've been reading MJ for almost a decade, they've taken a weird turn ever since this last election :^(
>> >>>
>> >>>> On Nov 20, 2017, at 4:55 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Um, the article said this:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "Anger, fear and animosity toward immigrants and minorities"
>> >>>>
>> >>>> That's his thesis.  Makes sense to me.  "Economic Anxiety" was just an excuse.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> David Morris
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 2:16 PM, Atticus Pinecone <atticuspinecone at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>> How does racism work in? Their skin color?
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> On Nov 20, 2017, at 2:52 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/11/heres-how-the-residents-of-super-white-america-voted-in-2016/
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> "In most places, even those that are heavily white, Trump won a smaller share of the vote than Romney did. The only places where he outperformed Romney were in the very whitest suburbs and small towns.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Put another way, anger, fear and animosity toward immigrants and minorities was most politically potent in the communities most insulated from these supposed threats."
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>    Virus-free. www.avg.com
>> >>
>> >> -
>> >> Pynchon-l / http://www.waste.org/mail/?list
>> >
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