Not BE Reread. America runs on less than 2/3 fossil fuels. Down even more since 2015 but can't find succinctly.

Joseph Tracy brook7 at sover.net
Sun Nov 14 00:38:04 UTC 2021 

That’s just electricity. What about fertilizer, gas for farm equipment, lawnmowing, shipping, oil refining, driving, flying, heating oil, manufacturing
equipment that runs on gas or oil, plastics, diesel trucking? There is also greenhouse gases released from concrete. These are not trivial sectors of the economy.   
> On Nov 13, 2021, at 2:34 PM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Coal
>  <http://needtoknow.nas.edu/energy/energy-sources/fossil-fuels/coal/>
> In 2015, 33.2% of U.S. electricity came from coal— roughly equal to natural gas (32.7%), but greater than nuclear power (20%) or renewable energy sources (13%).
> There is an abundant supply of coal in the United States and it’s a relatively inexpensive energy source, but it is declining in use. What are the costs of mining and burning this resource and is there a good way to address them?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 6:34 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> wrote:
> Said what I wish to say in earlier posts. Lost interest. Moving on.
> 
> > On Nov 12, 2021, at 6:19 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > So wank away in protest, and pretend your reasoning has any connection to anything other than identifying as a protester.  But you don’t even do that for real.
> > 
> > On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 5:55 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>> wrote:
> > Of course it translates into global warming. The economy runs on fossil fuel.
> > 
> > 
> >> On Nov 12, 2021, at 3:56 PM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >> 
> >> Um…
> >> 
> >> 1. A “hot” economy doesn’t translate into global warming. *That sounds like something Ted Cruz might say in a speech to idiots*. Now THAT you might call a put down.
> >> 
> >> 2.  Would you rather that we have a “cold” economy (in order to slow global warming?)? 
> >> 
> >> 3.  If you want to make “usury” QE into an evil, deceptive force that’s causing us to all see our hard-earned household safety and money melt away from our fingers, then what monetary strategy would you have implemented to try to claw back from the COVID recession which was greater than the 2008 Great Recession?
> >> 
> >> David Morris 
> >> 
> >> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 3:22 PM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>> wrote:
> >> Just want it to be clear that I am not opposed to  paper money  at all. The real issue for me  is putting usury and the financial industry  backed by fossil fuels/petrodollars and the war industry at t he center of the economy. The result may indeed be what David Morris’s reference calls a hot economy , but it is a heat that is all too real and is burning down  the biosphere.  Numbers are not the same as  breathable air, safe temperatures, clean water, food and shelter and friendship and music making. All the zeroes and ones in the universe do not add up to life. When your money that you worked just as hard for this week as last is losing value in almost every area, that is inflation. and that comes from an imbalance between dollars and real stuff. 
> >>   The fossil fuel companies contiue to get government support even as they dump billions of tons of waste material into air and ground that they are stealing from the earth and her people for use as a toxic waste dump. 
> >> 
> >> > On Nov 12, 2021, at 2:20 PM, Richard Romeo <richard.romeo at gmail.com <mailto:richard.romeo at gmail.com> <mailto:richard.romeo at gmail.com <mailto:richard.romeo at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >> > 
> >> > I think much the same, Joseph. The fossil fuel industry are nations unto themselves. And I’m not sure any President has much sway over them if we still have renewable energy still in its young adulthood and with nuclear in and out and back in of the picture. 
> >> > I don’t think of QE as good or bad, just another tool in the toolbox to spur economic growth in times of lackluster economic trends.
> >> > But the US does still have the advantage of the dollar containing to be the global base currency and we can tweak here and there 
> >> > I don’t see anyone going back to the gold standard. Money has been let loose. I can’t see how that genie gets back in the bottle. It’s so intertwined in the global economy now. 
> >> > I think all this ties into the irrelevance of nation states. Sure we have borders but money doesn’t. 
> >> > With that said, The US still has flexibility and control over its economy and currency. But it’s not a given with the current dysfunction, cynicism and corruption in the US today.
> >> > The US does need to invest in its infrastructure and in social programs. Which will benefit on many different levels, personal social and political. But not with the current leadership as is, much of it on the Republican side. It was bad enough when Reagan said govt was the problem; it’s gone way past that now. But we need govt to work. I’m not keen on Weimar comparisons but the hollowing out of effective governance is pretty clear
> >> > 
> >> > rich
> >> > 
> >> > 
> >> >> On Nov 12, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>> wrote:
> >> >> 
> >> >> Apologies for name fumble. too many commentators out there. My main point is I am highly dubious Biden will be seriously challenging the US fossil fuel industry in any substantive way.  I could certainly prove wrong but things don’t look good to me. Agree not relevant to BE. Not that important. 
> >> >> 
> >> >>> On Nov 12, 2021, at 10:30 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >> >>> 
> >> >>> It isn't Ignatious, it's Yglesias and his point is not about all that....
> >> >>> 
> >> >>> Biden has already changed some of the dynamics....
> >> >>> 
> >> >>> Otherwise, I'm not engaging since this is a good BE Read and everyone's interpretative analyses may differ. 
> >> >>> 
> >> >>>> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 10:21 AM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>>> wrote:
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> define “imaginary money.”
> >> >>> Basically when money is released into circulation that has no corresponding economic growth/new value. Many economists from different political positions and economic biases have questioned the benefits of Quantitative Easing as a solution to any and every sign of economic faltering. Already China and other countries are pulling away from the dollar  and Tbills as overvalued.  Tying up metals as markers of wealth seems like a waste of gold, silver, whatever as highly useful and decorative material. But people  around the world buy gold against inflation and it works pretty well. Also indebting the tax base to ever increasing military budgets is draining value from currency at a time when ecological threats far far outweigh military threats.  Passive solar houses and business buildings are a far better hedge against inflation than truckloads of high tech weapons that lose wars.  Locally grown food and locally made necessities the best hedge agains attenuated  fossil fuel dependent supply lines. 
> >> >>> 
> >> >>> IMO Ignatius is fantasizing if he thinks Biden is going to challenge the oil companies. Look at COP; look at the pipelines. The dollar = oil. 
> >> >>> Food is grown with fossil fuels, delivered with fossil fuels, wrapped in fossil fuels and converted into debt measured in fossil fuels. 
> >> >>> 
> >> >>> 
> >> >>>>> On Nov 12, 2021, at 9:12 AM, David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com>> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> Please define “imaginary money.”
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> Like, as opposed to gold or something?
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> I can’t wait for this…
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> David Morris
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>>> On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 8:54 AM Joseph Tracy <brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>>>>> wrote:
> >> >>>> Maybe not price gouging but when goverment pumps tons of imaginary money into the economy it starts to lose value. Quantitative Easing was the phrase.
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>>> On Nov 12, 2021, at 7:12 AM, Mark Kohut <mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>>> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>>>>> wrote:
> >> >>>>> 
> >> >>>>> Love in the Time of Web3, Pynchon is smiling when he saw that....
> >> >>>>> 
> >> >>>>> 
> >> >>>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>>>>>
> >> >>>>> Matthew Yglesias
> >> >>>>> @mattyglesias
> >> >>>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias>>>>>
> >> >>>>> ·
> >> >>>>> 12m <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389>>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389>> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389> <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389 <https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/1459126609521295389>>>>>
> >> >>>>> Agree with Robinson — you can’t take the politics out of politics! Biden
> >> >>>>> should also investigate price-gouging and anti-competitive behavior by
> >> >>>>> retail gas stations and have the FTC ask if cartel-like behavior by oil
> >> >>>>> company shareholders is restraining supply.
> >> >>>>> --
> >> >>>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>>>
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> 
> >> >>>> --
> >> >>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>>>
> >> >>> 
> >> >>> --
> >> >>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>>
> >> >> 
> >> >> --
> >> >> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>
> >> > 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> --
> >> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l> <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>>
> > 
> 
> --
> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>

More information about the Pynchon-l mailing list