No comment although I have them.
Mach Thomberi
machthomberi at gmail.com
Fri Oct 15 13:11:33 UTC 2021
This song, is eminently danceable.
>From your seat, rotate left and right, to the beat..
Eminence front. It's a put on! Eminence front!
Eminence Front - YouTube <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfrUQA2tb6M>
On Fri, Oct 15, 2021 at 7:02 AM Mike Weaver <mike.weaver at zen.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi foax,
>
> I only checked my personal account to pay my electricity bilI and what
> do I find...
>
> I was mysteriously unsubbed from the list in January 2020 and over the
> months have made several attempts to return. No links worked for me. A
> few days ago Olivia gave me a link that worked and I return to find what
> - I/P anguish and now the electric universe, tragedy to farce in one
> swift move.
>
> So whats' been happening - does the master get any attention or is it
> just the creatures at play and war. My determined effort to get back on
> was driven by my current re-read of Bleeding Edge, which I'm enjoying a
> lot more second time round. Not caring if I can't remember who's who,
> just tagging along with Maxine as she follows the trail.
>
> Better get back to work now - catch you all later.
> Mike
>
>
> On 15/10/2021 10:22, Mach Thomberi wrote:
> > Why what.
> >
> > Surely we have moved from an atomistic evolutionary cosmos. You do not
> > believe that.
> >
> > The things that you do, the everyday things. These are borne by, light.
> >
> > What guides your heart, your lungs, your kidneys. You can call it
> whatever
> > you want. Light.
> >
> > There is an electric universe, that exists as pulsations of varying
> > intensities. Beyond that, consciousness.
> >
> > Get used to it. The electric universe is here.
> >
> > Or you may call it the Crystalline Realm. It doesn't matter what you
> call
> > it. Vibration. Frequency.
> >
> > Light.
> >
> > On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 9:13 PM Ian Livingston <igrlivingston at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Why? What is born of light?
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:22 PM Mach Thomberi <machthomberi at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Now enough dick stroking. Who wants to talk Israel? No one but old
> >>> people.
> >>>
> >>> Or maybe rather than that cesspool of grit and vagabondage (Israel),
> speak
> >>> of something that has light in it.
> >>>
> >>> Something that is not, Israel. Not darkness.
> >>>
> >>> An illumination of light, that is making light, make light.
> >>>
> >>> We are here.
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 7:08 PM Mach Thomberi <machthomberi at gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> That is awesome. Thank you David.
> >>>>
> >>>> You too are the god of this list.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 6:28 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>> Thanks for the playlist. I’ve been totally removed from almost all
> new
> >>>>> music these last few years. So an injection like this is good.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> But now, after listening to the first two songs, I catch your gist.
> >>>>> About six years ago I had a very bad break up after 30 years married.
> >>> She
> >>>>> was harsh beyond words, and tried to literally destroy my life. I
> only
> >>>>> made it through with the help of my closest family and a few friends.
> >>> This
> >>>>> was the song I most remember from that time:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCFC9LamNMmLioW643VZ40OA
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Gotye - Somebody That I Used To Know (feat. Kimbra) [Official Music
> >>> Video]
> >>>>> David Morris
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Good Luck
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 6:52 PM Mach Thomberi <
> machthomberi at gmail.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/9TQKyDD9Yig
> >>>>>
> >>>>> <https://youtu.be/9TQKyDD9Yig>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Mabel: Smart and snappy pop. Words right to the point. I like it.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://youtu.be/cw_L8HdoYgo
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/OCyL6pa_L4M
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/YpJAmlnBxoA
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/PmAglGdibYs
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/VkKxmnrRVHo
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/4XaKR_svmMM
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> https://youtu.be/CevxZvSJLk8
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:48 PM Mach Thomberi <
> machthomberi at gmail.com
> >>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> https://youtu.be/8N2k-gv6xNE
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> https://youtu.be/mqFLXayD6e8
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> https://youtu.be/dgjTO5eAbZY
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:46 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>> machthomberi at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> https://youtu.be/kHue-HaXXzg
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:45 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>> machthomberi at gmail.com
> >>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I don't get these songs. I have not even listened to them.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> How they relate to Pynchon, well I might know if she didn't have
> >>> all
> >>>>>> my
> >>>>>>>>> books.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:38 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>>>>> machthomberi at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> I told my ex, because I couldn't stand the incessant texts--oh
> >>> here
> >>>>>> is
> >>>>>>>>>> another one--that are mind and soul numbing iterations of sheer
> >>>>>>>>>> obtuse rage, to try contacting me irather in songs.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Which she has proceeded in doing...
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:13 PM Mark Kohut <
> mark.kohut at gmail.com
> >>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Nah, I think I'm more the kidney, too occasionally the spleen.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Go in peace.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:49 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>>>>> machthomberi at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Mark, come on, you are the god of plist.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> It would not exist without you.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> You are a Titan.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> You make light in a world of darkness.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 4:14 PM Mark Kohut <
> >>> mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Take care.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I do not think I am what you say about the plist. He is
> >>> buried in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Milwaukee, with a seat in his name at his favorite movie
> >>> theater.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I just 1) usually respond. 2) like to send some stuff I
> >>> find
> >>>>>> that
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> might interest and might lead to discussion.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I am away from it for days and weeks at a time. Monroe never
> >>> was.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry for your turmoil and loss.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 5:10 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> machthomberi at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> We all know that you are the heart and soul of plist, Mark.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Without you it would be the nonplist.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> As I sat down to write this, your email came in. As I am
> >>>>>> writing
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, there is one from Morrrs. Which I'll receive after
> this.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The most amazing thing happened. I left my woman a few days
> >>>>>> ago..
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> And in doing so, I told her that I can no longer bare her
> >>> rage.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Fair enough. I was being the cool guy in leaving.. Then I
> >>> got
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> this email, from you idiots. Saying something about Israel.
> >>>>>> And it is
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> obvious, that, something, like rage, fell forth. I was
> >>> telling
> >>>>>> her about
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> her rage, when then something, emanated. Perhaps there is
> >>>>>> something within
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> me. Maybe we suppress it.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The timing of it was exquisite.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> And everything I say is true.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 3:48 PM Mark Kohut <
> >>>>>> mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because it isn't TOTAL. 😇
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Let me FUCKING SIMPLIFY FOR YOU:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> BIDEN ADMIN CLIMATE PROPOSALS FULFILL THE UN GOALS.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I will add that the admin has a TOTAL, speaking of
> >>> totalizing,
> >>>>>> ALL
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OF GOVERNMENT mandate re attacking climate change.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Worked into diplomacy, all other bills (if they can be),
> >>>>>> executive
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> orders, as has happened.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 3:52 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> machthomberi at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One might what. I didn't quite get the jizz of that
> >>> mindless
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schpieel.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why can't we change it from the plist to the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TOTAL FUCKING KOHUT LIST.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 14, 2021 12:02 PM, "Mark Kohut" <
> >>> mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, the US commitments to effect climate change, have
> >>> been
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> called by an
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outside organization, policies that match
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the recommendations as necessary, that if all countries
> >>> were
> >>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> commit to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and do would meet the goal
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of staying under 2 degrees Celsius per the recent MAJOR,
> >>>>>> scary,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> UN
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Report.....
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is, these policies meet the UN Report's
> >>> recommendations
> >>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> achieve the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stated goal. One might think the admin
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> talked to the UN as that report was being written---the
> >>>>>> science
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> compiled
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over years, as we know--and met the guidelines. One
> >>>>>> might.....
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 11:17 AM Joseph Tracy <
> >>>>>> brook7 at sover.net>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have that clear a take on some imagined world
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> majority and I
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wish I could sincerely agree but at this point I stand
> >>> with
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Greta, what we
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hear from so called leaders is blah blah, blah, and
> >>> what we
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> see is growing
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> arms sales , continued growth in C02 emissions, threats
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> violent
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blockades by the US, mass survellance, publishers being
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tortured for
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> publishing the same thing as the NY Times, pipelines
> >>> and a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> revived nuclear
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> arms program. I could go on but what is the point.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It’s true that there are many, many people who want
> >>>>>> change
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and they
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gladden my heart as they do yours. They are not yet
> >>>>>> organized
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as an
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> effective agent of change though most do what they can.
> >>> In
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lead up to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the second Iraq war the world saw the biggest anti-war
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> demonstration in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> human history and the biggest global demonstration ever,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rivaled only by
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> climate crisis activism. It did not stop the war and was
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> barely covered in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the US press.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 14, 2021, at 10:00 AM, Mark Kohut <
> >>>>>> mark.kohut at gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I will assert as baldly as your assertions that the
> >>>>>> majority
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the people
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the Pokey Little Puppy's Whole
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wide World are acting and imagining outside of this
> >>> blanket
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> condemnation:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "imagine solutions than are not reliant on war,
> poisons
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ecological
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rape."
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Many businesses, many countries, with whatever else they
> >>>>>> are
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> also doing,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are acting FINALLY against this 'reliance".
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 9:51 AM Joseph Tracy <
> >>>>>> brook7 at sover.net>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The historic creation of Israel is a subject that has
> >>>>>> already
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> led to many
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many books and articles. I have read quite a few of
> >>> those
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> books. What I
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> said is what I said, and I wasn’t trying to ccomplish
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> whatever you or
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mathew c think I should have been. But without a doubt
> >>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so-called
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> creation of Israel has involved decades of assult on
> >>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Palestinians who
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lived there before the Jewish settlers came. It was as
> >>>>>> much
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an act of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> destruction and theft in my view as an act of
> >>> creation. In
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the same way the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> “creation” of the US required a destructive assault on
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> indiginous people.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel seems to me to follow the biblical paradigm of
> >>>>>> Zionism
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> layed out in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the legends of Joshua and later David. I think that is
> >>>>>> clear
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enough and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quite defensible as a proposition.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As far as I can tell most countries are acts of
> >>>>>> imagination
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> violence based on tilling and armies, they are a
> >>> product
> >>>>>> of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the paradigm of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> war . National borders and rules are usually a lot more
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> arbitrary than
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> natural human self organizing and require leaders
> >>> imposing
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taxes through
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> violence. Since the advent of mass production and
> >>> fossil
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fuels we have a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new paradigm that combines the economic predations of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> investment capitalism
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with the military power or imperial alliances. This is
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quickly destroying
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the biospheric stability of the planet. Our
> >>> imaginations
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could be put to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> better use. We are not bound to follow our path of self
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> destruction by
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything other than unwillingness to face the problems
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> imagine
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> solutions than are not reliant on war, poisons and
> >>>>>> ecological
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rape.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 14, 2021, at 7:49 AM, Mark Kohut <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mark.kohut at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Joseph,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Without distinctions, your generalities about all
> >>>>>> countries
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> everywhere
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and when are always correct.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yet say nothing substantive about the creation of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel--or any other
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> country for that matter.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And do little (or nothing) for discussion of all your
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Historic evils
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but show us a nice, beautifully-expressed personal
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> credo--open to all: "the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heart of this holy path is to choose life, to love the
> >>>>>> great
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mystery of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being wih all the heart and all the mind and the very
> >>>>>> kernel
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of life we
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have been given, and to treat others as we wish to be
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> treated.”
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Guess what. That is not a personal credo, Those are
> >>> ideas
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from Judaism(
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Torah and Maimonedes) which I appreciate and try to
> >>>>>> honor
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in my life.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 12:21 AM Joseph Tracy <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> brook7 at sover.net
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:brook7 at sover.net>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Annihilation is a loaded word. It sounds cruel and
> >>>>>> violent.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Truthfully
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> though, a name or concept or form of government can be
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> eliminated or
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> replaced without destroying human lives or poisoning
> >>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> earth. Nations and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> religions have changed and died before with little or
> >>> even
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> benign
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> consequences. And those nations that survived and
> >>> rose to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> become “great
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> powers" have a pretty shitty track record to justify
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> themselves. Imagine
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all the people living life in peace.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don’t know exactly what Thomberi ( sounds a made up
> >>>>>> name)
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> intending, whether tongue in cheek or weirdly sincere,
> >>>>>> but I
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think matthew
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> c is wildly sentimentalizing how Israel came into
> >>> being.
> >>>>>> As
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to what is to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be done. It is a question for all of us, not just
> >>> Israel.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Settler
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> colonialism and its cruelties are embedded in most of
> >>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> world. Western
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> civilization as configured has desertified vast parts
> >>> of
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> globe, moved
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sane indiginous cultures into bantustans and is rapidly
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> destroying the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> diverse species upon which life as we know it exists,
> >>>>>> rapidly
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> moving us
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> toward waves of mass destruction . As for me, yes i
> >>>>>> really am
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ready to hand
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over my land and the very concept of property to the
> >>>>>> tribal
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> peoples of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> north america. Would they want this mess, our
> >>> mini-flags,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> banks and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fracking machines? I don’t know, but I could not be
> >>> more
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> serious about my
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> acre of workspace , fruit trees, asparagus, maple
> >>> trees,
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stone walls.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My whole life is about the effort to move myself and
> >>>>>> others
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> toward an
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ecologically sustainable life, and the biggest
> >>> impediment
> >>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> change is the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settler colonialist warfare that continues from the
> >>>>>> ancient
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to the modern
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> world, that turns from warlordism to nationalism to
> >>>>>> imperial
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> warfare. What
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel and the US and China and Russia and Brazil and
> >>>>>> Canada
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and so many
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rapacious military dictatorships are expressing in this
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shared planet is
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> varying forms of sociopathic madness organized by
> >>> self
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> destructive
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dreams, egomania, and imaginary polities that have
> >>> ravaged
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> our common sense
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as animals, our friendliness as neighbors, our ability
> >>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> choose life above
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> what they have too offer. And what do they have to
> >>> offer
> >>>>>> as
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> civilization crumbles? Comfortable places to watch the
> >>>>>> world
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> burn, endless
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> entertaining air conditioned shitpiles, debt, fat
> >>> people
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> eating big juicy
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hamburgers and an all too violent and real global
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> annihilation, James Bond
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> may or may not have lost his dick, but he stil has a
> >>>>>> license
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to kill.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Zionism is the same disease as the master race,
> >>>>>> manifest
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> destiny,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> salafism, pax romana, capitalism, militarism. Its
> >>> origins
> >>>>>> can
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be read by
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone. Joshua crosses into “ the promised land” to
> >>> kill
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sinful
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Canaanites or make them into slaves to the chosen
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people.”Blessed is he who
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dashes thy little ones against a stone”. This fable has
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> become the script
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for modern day Israel, just as some version of this
> >>> script
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has written so
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> much human history. It will script global suicide if we
> >>>>>> let
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it. If we
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot prevent it.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Zionism was never the remarkable part of Judaism, the
> >>>>>> heart
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of this
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> holy path is to choose life, to love the great mystery
> >>> of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being wih all the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heart and all the mind and the very kernel of life we
> >>> have
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been given, and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to treat others as we wish to be treated.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 13, 2021, at 4:14 PM, matthew cissell <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mccissell at gmail.com
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:mccissell at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mach,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So let me see. You seem to propose the
> >>> annihilation of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel, a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> country
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> created whole cloth from ideas, dreams, stories and
> >>>>>> more
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> by carving
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> space for that community that had formed a nation
> >>> but
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lacked a state.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ok. Two things (that I'll say) occur to me: What do
> >>>>>> you
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> propose for
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people? Do you have some... solution for them as
> >>> well?
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Would it be
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the same
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for Arabic and Jewish citizens? What would it
> >>> entail?
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Next: If you (and others that share your view) are
> >>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> descendent of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Europeans living in the Americas (or some other
> >>>>>> previously
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> colonized place), I suppose you are also ready to
> >>>>>> 'undo'
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your county
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hand over your land to the indigenous communities.
> >>> Or
> >>>>>> are
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you writing
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> somewhere else, in which case we might talk about
> >>> that
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> place.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Criticizing the trespasses of any country or
> >>>>>> government
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is one thing,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calling for its abolition is something else. The
> >>>>>> actions
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israeli
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> government have often been reprehensible or even
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> criminal, but that
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not justify your language, which would certainly
> >>> find
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> applause and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> echoes
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in a certain rising current in not only US
> >>> political
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> discourse but
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> widely.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm responding not because I think your mind is
> >>>>>> likely to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be changed
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because I want you and others to know that in this
> >>>>>> open
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> forum you
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will find
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> voices that do not apathetically ignore your
> >>>>>> statements.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ne Obliviscaris
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Matthew Cissell
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 4:33 PM Mach Thomberi <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> machthomberi at gmail.com
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:machthomberi at gmail.com>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No we wouldn't want that would we. Deprive Israel
> >>>>>> water
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> medicine.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What would be marvelous. Would be removing Israel
> >>>>>> from
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the map.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cut it
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out and dispense it into the ether.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then do likewise of our collective memory of
> >>> Israel.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 13, 2021 9:23 AM, "Joseph Tracy" <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> brook7 at sover.net <mailto:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> brook7 at sover.net>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would not go so far as to cut Israelis off from
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> medicine or clean
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> water
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as they have done to Gaza, but a cultural
> >>> boycott is
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> potentially a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bring the debate into a more public sphere. We
> >>> need
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equally to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> confront
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> what so many in the western press and politics
> >>> have
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> done on this
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> issue.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They have supported the insane idea that anyone
> >>>>>> who
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> publicly
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> criticizes
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel’s abuse of Palestinians is doing so out of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anti-semitism.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> labeled anti-semitic even if they are Jews whose
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> parents and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> relatives
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> survived or died in Nazi concentration camps.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sally Rooney said she would be honored to have
> >>> her
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> book translated
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hebrew but will not work with a publisher who
> >>> does
> >>>>>> not
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> distance
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> themselves
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from Israel’s aparteid treatment of Palestinians.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 11, 2021, at 3:44 PM, David Morris <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fqmorris at gmail.com
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:fqmorris at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why no comment? This is a place for opinion.
> >>> As
> >>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me, I say
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bravo! I
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think Israel deserves full apartheid treatment
> >>>>>> right
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now. And too
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people are afraid to say so. There! I said
> >>> it.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> David Morris
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 3:25 PM Mark Kohut <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mark.kohut at gmail.com
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:mark.kohut at gmail.com>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> https://forward.com/opinion/476513/why-wont-sally-rooney-
> >>> <
> >>> https://forward.com/opinion/476513/why-wont-sally-rooney-
> >>> allow-her-latest-novel-to-be-translated-into-hebrew/
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
> >>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
> >>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <
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> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
> >>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l <
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
> >>> https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>>>>> <
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> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L:
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> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
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> >>>>>>
> >>> --
> >>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>>
> > --
> > Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>
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