Fwd: Germany, experts on Nazism as they say here, tell Russia to fuck off and speak the truth many couldn't see.

[Martin Dietze]

The question has never been whether nazis exist in a society. They do in
pretty much every one.
Німецький вертоліт claims far more:
That they are a decisive force in Ukraine which is plain bullshit (yes, and
now will come the usual list of links to some credible sources claiming
otherwise).
Then comes of course the antisemitism claim which, too, is absurd as the
biggest jewish organisations in Ukraine keep confirming (again backed by
the usual list of some credible sources claiming otherwise).
Also now our "expert" claims Ukraine not to be a peaceful country; in the
Russian war in the East Ukraine is allegedly the aggressor, which is pure
nonsense (however the usual list of ... you know what, this time with some
serious misinterpreting and lack of context).

Making such bold statements about a country someone does not know has
become quite commonplace when it's about Ukraine. And when somebody is just
again and again repeating the Russian disinformation bible (which, as good
propaganda always is, is a mixture of some genuine facts, half truth and
plain lies), I can usually tell it, because I have been confronted and
struggling with this shit for the last more than 15 years. And one thing is
clear from the start: you can never convince such people. They are true
believers, absolutely certain that they are on the TRUE PATH. So best you
can do is argue in order to convince others.

However now the time for arguing is over. Russia has brought open, all-out
and terrible war to that country. We are all struggling to help where we
can. RL has got so much more important than online debates.

That's why for now I am answering you but will keep telling німецький
вертоліт to fuck himself. People like him have contributed to make this war
possible by spreading the Kremlin's lies and deligitimising Ukraine's cause
in Western societies' public. There is no excuse for this anymore.


On Fri, 11 Mar 2022 at 03:04, rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:

> I think it does matter since right-wing terror has been underplayed in the
> West (many supported by Putin) for quite awhile now. These groups thrive on
> chaos. any country seeking whatever way you want to describe openess,
> freedom, etc has to be vigilant against any ideology that seeks to crush
> those ideals. The fight against Putin is the most important and dangerous
> fight right now, but there will be others.
> Who knows how this war will end. One can only surmise that both Ukraine and
> Russia will be very different countries at the end, both most likely
> bankrupt, Ukraine literally, Russia morally and financially, perfect ground
> for such groups to breed. it's all so utterly depressing
>
> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 7:20 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Does it matter if they exist?  I have agreed to accept that they exist.
> So
> > where would that acknowledgment get us in understanding our present
> > situation?  Does it justify it?  Would a survey of its pervasiveness help
> > us decide a path forward?  I’m not being facetious here.
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 4:53 PM rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In Thomas' defense I don't believe he wants to see Ukraine humbled by
> >> Putin but pointed out some nasty elements within Ukraine (a virus that
> >> effects many countries) in its armed forces and establishment today and
> >> historically. It doesn't mean anything more than it's a problem that may
> >> need to be addressed in future. No one is saying the bulk of Ukrainian
> >> forces are neo-Nazis just that they exist. Just like in Russia, US, in
> >> Germany and elsewhere. I think acknowledging it is not falling for
> Russian
> >> propaganda
> >>
> >> rich
> >>
> >> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 4:33 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >>> So, Thomas:
> >>> *What IS your argument*?
> >>>
> >>> Do you have a point to make?  I think a lot of us know that you think
> >>> *Ukraine
> >>> has ALOT of neo Nazis in its ranks*.  So, *if that’s true*,  what is
> your
> >>> argument now?  How should we let that information (let’s just say it’s
> >>> true, for the sake of your argument), direct us as a world body *right
> >>> now*?
> >>>
> >>> David Morris
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 4:07 PM Thomas Eckhardt via Pynchon-l
> >>>
> >>> Lovely. When you have no arguments, just shoot the messenger.
> >>
> >>
> >>> --
> >>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
> >>>
> >>
> --
> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>


-- 
Dr. Martin Dietze
[https://www.martins-braindumps.de/]
1. Vorsitzender
Deutsch-Ukrainischer Kulturverein e.V.
[http://www.deutsch-ukrainischer-kulturverein.de/]