Fwd: Germany, experts on Nazism as they say here, tell Russia to fuck off and speak the truth many couldn't see.

[rich]

I don't think it impacts or explains the life and death decisions on the
ground in Ukraine as fighting an all out war is paramount.

The obvious answer to no 2 is of course not. That has been pretty clear
from Putin and his false reasoning which Martin has emphasized again and
again which I'm totally on board with. Now they are pushing the US has
biochem weapons factories in Ukraine. Putin's justifications change day by
day. Straight  from the US WMD Iraq war playbook.

Who knows the level of such right wing radicals in the country. I would not
even guess. I would hope any such people would not be welcome if and when
the war ends. No doubt Putin will encourage these people win or lose. If
there is a path forward it is to crush them and Putin.

rich

On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 10:15 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:

> I wasn’t looking for an abstract or philosophical answer about whether it
> matters that they exist.  I have agreed to the stipulation that they
> exist.  I guess I asked the wrong question.
>
> *HOW* does it (acknowledging the existence of a right-wing schism group
> in Ukraine (I DID NOT say terror group - you added that)) matter ****Right
> Now***  *as members of this World Body Politic?
>
> 1. where does that acknowledgment get us in understanding our present
> situation?
>
> 2. Does it justify it? (Russia’s Invasion and War?)
>
> 3.  Would a survey of its pervasiveness help us decide a path forward?
>
> David Morris
>
> And, God forbid, Putin decides to lob a “small” nuclear weapon somewhere
> or other, can we all agree that a neo-Nazi presence in Ukraine really
> doesn’t fucking matter anymore?
>
> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 9:03 PM rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I think it does matter since right-wing terror has been underplayed in
>> the West (many supported by Putin) for quite awhile now. These groups
>> thrive on chaos. any country seeking whatever way you want to describe
>> openess, freedom, etc has to be vigilant against any ideology that seeks to
>> crush those ideals. The fight against Putin is the most important and
>> dangerous fight right now, but there will be others.
>> Who knows how this war will end. One can only surmise that both Ukraine
>> and Russia will be very different countries at the end, both most likely
>> bankrupt, Ukraine literally, Russia morally and financially, perfect ground
>> for such groups to breed. it's all so utterly depressing
>>
>
>
>> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 7:20 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Does it matter if they exist?  I have agreed to accept that they exist.
>>> So where would that acknowledgment get us in understanding our present
>>> situation?  Does it justify it?  Would a survey of its pervasiveness help
>>> us decide a path forward?  I’m not being facetious here.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 4:53 PM rich <richard.romeo at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In Thomas' defense I don't believe he wants to see Ukraine humbled by
>>>> Putin but pointed out some nasty elements within Ukraine (a virus that
>>>> effects many countries) in its armed forces and establishment today and
>>>> historically. It doesn't mean anything more than it's a problem that may
>>>> need to be addressed in future. No one is saying the bulk of Ukrainian
>>>> forces are neo-Nazis just that they exist. Just like in Russia, US, in
>>>> Germany and elsewhere. I think acknowledging it is not falling for Russian
>>>> propaganda
>>>>
>>>> rich
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 4:33 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> So, Thomas:
>>>>> *What IS your argument*?
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you have a point to make?  I think a lot of us know that you think
>>>>> *Ukraine
>>>>> has ALOT of neo Nazis in its ranks*.  So, *if that’s true*,  what is
>>>>> your
>>>>> argument now?  How should we let that information (let’s just say it’s
>>>>> true, for the sake of your argument), direct us as a world body *right
>>>>> now*?
>>>>>
>>>>> David Morris
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 4:07 PM Thomas Eckhardt via Pynchon-l
>>>>>
>>>>> Lovely. When you have no arguments, just shoot the messenger.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Pynchon-L: https://waste.org/mailman/listinfo/pynchon-l
>>>>>
>>>>