NP: Re: more new Dylan

[ish mailian]

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:40 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> We must have different thoughts on what lyrical means.  To me it means a play of sound.  Tripping of tongue and lilt of sounds.

OK, I should have understood your meaning the first time. So we agree
it's not lyrical.
>
> I think Dylan's verse here is more grafitti than sonnet.  It is a purposeful mix of disconnected icons, tied together by the last line.

Your quite a poet yourself, David. Read, with pleasure, many a haiku
from you. I love your contrasting imagery here, of graffiti and
sonnet. But Dylan's words here, while not so strictly arranged in a
tight metric arrangement, surely not a traditional sonnet, are
arranged in a traditional metric pattern,  so not graffiti either,
though I get what you mean, and I agree that it's *more graffiti* than
sonnet.  He is, though, still working in a traditional form, but it's
quick, sprayed out, words of the prophets on the subway walls and
tenement halls.


>
> I never said it was profound.  Others have said similar things with much greater finess.  But not many pop stars have.





>
> David Morris
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:36 PM ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Doesn't need to be lyrical; didn't say it did, didn't say it is
>> lyrical or isn't lyrical. I'll say it now, it is lyrical.
>> A lyric poem has a song-like quality and an exploration of emotions
>> and personal feelings.
>>
>> While poetry itself can't be defined, one of the characteristic of
>> some great poetry is compression, that is, as you noted, "it makes a
>> statement with very few words."
>>
>> But on four counts I say the lyric is not great poetry:
>> it does not appeal to the intellect, there is nothing much to think
>> about here, the final line of the excerpt Thomas posted is only one
>> that nearly induces wonder or thought, but it's awkward, bad. Lost
>> things are made good?
>> it fails to excite the senses
>> it does not move with emotion
>> and it lacks imagination
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 4:39 PM David Morris <fqmorris at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > It might not be lyrical, but that's not the only standard of poetry.  It references familiar icons to make a statement with very few words.
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:04 PM ish mailian <ishmailian at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Not sure what's inappropriate.
>> >> It's not great poetry, that's for sure.
>> >>
>> >> > "I’m just like Anne Frank, like Indiana Jones
>> >> > And them British bad boys, the Rolling Stones
>> >> > I go right to the edge, I go right to the end
>> >> > I go right where all things lost are made good again"
>> --
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